I should say that maybe one of the reasons I get on my soapbox about a particular rescue experience is that the rescue in question has a history of BEGGING and PLEADING for people to adopt dogs. I should also say that it isn't the first time that I have taken a rehome from a reputable breeder because the reputable breeder is easier to deal with than the rescue. Meaning that the breeder knowing you personally and knowing how you take care of your dogs makes things easier.
Well I got told...
- Thread starter Peter Maniate
- Start date
Puppypeoplenj
New member
I imagine this is the route I'll end up taking as well. I'm not against a rescue organization having any stipulations at all, I just think the ones I've seen, including fencing and/or acreage and one person in the home all day are extreme.
Murphy
New member
Thank You Jane !!! Thank You
Newfs Forever
New member
Jane, bless you, you articulate so well!
I do understand Jane's point about the need for objective standards. I just don't think a fenced yard necessarily makes for a more responsible owner. I know people who leave their dogs out in fenced yards for much of the day. Our dog likes to be in the house with us, often on our laps! We had a fenced yard when we had our first Newf. He didn't like to be out there unless we were. I've even seen people on here talk about having to take a dog out on a leash for potty trips as if it's an unreasonable inconvenience. I just see it as part of the responsibility of having a dog, and, no, I haven't always lived in a warm climate. I know I won't change the minds of any rescue folks, and I understand your dedication. I know saying the right things doesn't guarantee a good home, but neither does having the right "things" in place.
It isn't about you being a more responsible or better owner. Don't think that rescue people think you are a bad owner if you don't have a fence. They don't, I assure you.
Adoption isn't about you, it's about the dog that they are trying to place at any given moment. Rescues can and sometimes do make exceptions for certain dogs, but it's on an individual basis according to the dog's needs.
We get many really wonderful people applying for dogs, but we match each dog by it's needs to the best possible conditions. So if there is a situation that is more desirable than what you are offering (in this case a fenced yard), another potential adopter(s) is going to be considered over you. So if there is a waiting list of people with fences, and then there's you...
If the dog has certain emotional, medical or behavior modification needs, we may require that the potential adopter is home for the better portion of the day. If the dog is crippled, we may require a ramp if there are steps. If the dog is unruly or maybe rough with kids, we may have age restrictions on children. But it's by individual dog. Foster homes live with these dogs and each dog is assessed according to his skill level, temperament, health, etc. We try hard to find out everything we can about each dog long before he is put up on some website for adoption. But we can't know everything and have to assume certain things. Like if the dog might be a squirrel chasing, door bolter who can slip past a sumo wrestler in a nanosecond and run into the street before the owner knows what happened.
Some adopters are hoping for a dog that would do well in therapy, some want to do water or draft work, some just want a companion. We take all those factors into consideration as well and if we don't have a dog that meets that person's requirements, we will keep them in mind for a future rescue dog. But we won't give them a dog that isn't suited to them or whose own needs can't be met, just because they are wonderful responsible owners. And we don't choose the application that is at the top of the waiting list. It has to be the right match.
Rescue doesn't have an unlimited supply of dogs, and nearly all of the ones they have, came in with some kind of issue. We never have any healthy, perfect temperament, well trained dogs waiting in queues for homes. It's a lot different than homing a puppy who is a blank slate.
If you want rescue to reconsider you, ask if someone will come to your home, observe the conditions, meet all the family members, see your own dogs, or make suggestions, etc. If they are satisfied, then ask them to keep you on their list for a future dog that may be better suited to you.
That being said, some rescues are adamant about things like fences. It still doesn't mean they think less of you, so please stop being offended if you're turned down. It isn't about you.
Adoption isn't about you, it's about the dog that they are trying to place at any given moment. Rescues can and sometimes do make exceptions for certain dogs, but it's on an individual basis according to the dog's needs.
We get many really wonderful people applying for dogs, but we match each dog by it's needs to the best possible conditions. So if there is a situation that is more desirable than what you are offering (in this case a fenced yard), another potential adopter(s) is going to be considered over you. So if there is a waiting list of people with fences, and then there's you...
If the dog has certain emotional, medical or behavior modification needs, we may require that the potential adopter is home for the better portion of the day. If the dog is crippled, we may require a ramp if there are steps. If the dog is unruly or maybe rough with kids, we may have age restrictions on children. But it's by individual dog. Foster homes live with these dogs and each dog is assessed according to his skill level, temperament, health, etc. We try hard to find out everything we can about each dog long before he is put up on some website for adoption. But we can't know everything and have to assume certain things. Like if the dog might be a squirrel chasing, door bolter who can slip past a sumo wrestler in a nanosecond and run into the street before the owner knows what happened.
Some adopters are hoping for a dog that would do well in therapy, some want to do water or draft work, some just want a companion. We take all those factors into consideration as well and if we don't have a dog that meets that person's requirements, we will keep them in mind for a future rescue dog. But we won't give them a dog that isn't suited to them or whose own needs can't be met, just because they are wonderful responsible owners. And we don't choose the application that is at the top of the waiting list. It has to be the right match.
Rescue doesn't have an unlimited supply of dogs, and nearly all of the ones they have, came in with some kind of issue. We never have any healthy, perfect temperament, well trained dogs waiting in queues for homes. It's a lot different than homing a puppy who is a blank slate.
If you want rescue to reconsider you, ask if someone will come to your home, observe the conditions, meet all the family members, see your own dogs, or make suggestions, etc. If they are satisfied, then ask them to keep you on their list for a future dog that may be better suited to you.
That being said, some rescues are adamant about things like fences. It still doesn't mean they think less of you, so please stop being offended if you're turned down. It isn't about you.
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Murphy
New member
Rescues can be unpredictable and no matter the amount of assessment done in a foster home cannot necessarily predict future behaviour. I guess that applies to just about any dog but more so those who come from backgrounds that are at best just unknown and at worse neglected and abused. Can't rely on what previous owners tell us.
My point is that secure fencing gives added protection that is needed and yes, for the most part can be a deal breaker. Exceptions can and have been made. But as Jane indicated.... if someone were to be passed over for lack of adequate secure fencing, it is not meant to offend or insult anyone. At the end of the day, rescue needs to do what is best for our fosters, cause they don't have a voice.
Very good points made on this thread and a good discussion. :beer:
My point is that secure fencing gives added protection that is needed and yes, for the most part can be a deal breaker. Exceptions can and have been made. But as Jane indicated.... if someone were to be passed over for lack of adequate secure fencing, it is not meant to offend or insult anyone. At the end of the day, rescue needs to do what is best for our fosters, cause they don't have a voice.
Very good points made on this thread and a good discussion. :beer:
Here's one final reason why rescue organizations have requirements in the first place...insurance. In order to operate, they must carry insurance. In order to get insurance they have to provide copies of the adoption contracts and any documents which stipulate the conditions required for adoption. Insurance companies are not overly fond of insuring dog related organizations, and I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be interested in providing their services if the rescue organization didn't have conditions for adoption.
If the rescue fails to hold the adopter to those conditions, they can be held liable if something happens and may also lose their insurance, or the insurance company may refuse to pay on a claim. And for the rescue organization, it may spell the end of their existence and that doesn't help anyone. Has nothing whatsoever to do with the adopter being a responsible owner.
If the rescue fails to hold the adopter to those conditions, they can be held liable if something happens and may also lose their insurance, or the insurance company may refuse to pay on a claim. And for the rescue organization, it may spell the end of their existence and that doesn't help anyone. Has nothing whatsoever to do with the adopter being a responsible owner.
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ElvisTheNewf
Active member
Wow. I never thought about the insurance aspect. This has been one of the best threads I've seen on here in awhile. Thank you.
DAWNMERIE
Active member
I do agree, thank you Jane for pointing that out.
mudji
New member
I have had 4 newfs over the past 20 years. Three of them came from rescue organizations. I was personally assessed to ensure I knew what I was going through from the size of the dog, to the expense involved. I am a member of NCA, as well. And having had only newfs throughout my entire life, you can see I'm totally committed to the breed for many reasons, including my allergies to dogs with the exception of newfs. My first two came from SENC, and while they did require a fenced yard, I did not have one. My dogs lived inside with me. I agree with those here that a fenced yard should not be a deal breaker. While I certainly understand why there are rules, any one here who knows me, knows of my undying love for the breed and its well being. I would hate to have a rescue organization turn my application down because I live in a condo now and have no fenced yard, but do totally understand what it means to be a responsible newfie owner. Luckily, there are no weight restrictions where I live for dogs, only that I can only have two.
Just my $0.02.
Just my $0.02.
jolliz
New member
Each case is different.
I was not allowed to adopt a Newf here in Ontario because my yard isn't fully fenced. It's a 1.15 acre rural residential lot with woods and trails behind. Our neighbour has a chain link down one side and we have heavy shrubs but it isn't fenced.
We've had five dogs over 29 years here, two were rescues and one a senior dog from a shelter. Two were Newfs and three of the dogs have died from old age. We always train our dogs on a long line for months, and don't leave them alone or tied up. Even if I had a fence I wouldn't leave a dog alone outside.
After my first Newf died of old age, I was so upset I waited 5-6 years to try and adopt another one, and I was told by a Newf rescue in Ontario that it would cost $1,000. When I told that to a lady who lives near me, she said the same guy sold her a rescue dog for $300. All her friends paid about that too.
So I went down to the States and found a lovely Newf from a rescue group which probably ended up costing me more due to transportation and some health issues that were eventually cleared up at my vet. I still don't have a fence but before she came we had a nice home visit from a gal here in Ontario. My Newf Izzy has been here for 8 years and is now 11. She is well loved and looked after. We just got her groomed today.
There are some Newfs that body slam or dig, so I can certainly see why rescue groups would be worried about fencing, but no one in Ontario would even check or come to the house. No fence. No dog, and the arbitrary cost was a red flag for me.
Is this a bad thing? I don't know but I was offended by it all. I feel very lucky to have a Newf at all. When my old girl dies she will probably be the last Newf I own as I don't qualify for a rescue. I am uninterested in puppies or breeders, I like the older dogs.
Three years ago I asked a rescue group about a Lab after my old Lab died of lymphoma. They never got back to me, and had very strict rules about e-mailing and times for replies, and that dog is still up for adoption. I on the other hand adopted a nice 9 year-old Lab from a shelter who is having a great life with us.
Years ago when looking for our first Newf, we went to a Newf breeder in Ontario and she made some snarky remarks about how we'd never get a Newf in our Honda Civic hatchback. We actually got TWO dogs in there, a Lab and a Newf, and we travelled around with them quite a bit, which they loved.
I found out later that her breeding dogs had heart problems that were passed on, so we made a lucky escape. There are ignorant adopters but there are also ignorant breeders.
You need to get to know people before adopting. It works both ways. We live in a society that loves "instant" and "fast" and adopting a dog needs time and an effort to get to know adopters or breeders and rescue groups.
I've known people, we all have, who matched every criteria for dog ownership and still treated their dogs abysmally, neglecting and chaining them or worse.
I was not allowed to adopt a Newf here in Ontario because my yard isn't fully fenced. It's a 1.15 acre rural residential lot with woods and trails behind. Our neighbour has a chain link down one side and we have heavy shrubs but it isn't fenced.
We've had five dogs over 29 years here, two were rescues and one a senior dog from a shelter. Two were Newfs and three of the dogs have died from old age. We always train our dogs on a long line for months, and don't leave them alone or tied up. Even if I had a fence I wouldn't leave a dog alone outside.
After my first Newf died of old age, I was so upset I waited 5-6 years to try and adopt another one, and I was told by a Newf rescue in Ontario that it would cost $1,000. When I told that to a lady who lives near me, she said the same guy sold her a rescue dog for $300. All her friends paid about that too.
So I went down to the States and found a lovely Newf from a rescue group which probably ended up costing me more due to transportation and some health issues that were eventually cleared up at my vet. I still don't have a fence but before she came we had a nice home visit from a gal here in Ontario. My Newf Izzy has been here for 8 years and is now 11. She is well loved and looked after. We just got her groomed today.
There are some Newfs that body slam or dig, so I can certainly see why rescue groups would be worried about fencing, but no one in Ontario would even check or come to the house. No fence. No dog, and the arbitrary cost was a red flag for me.
Is this a bad thing? I don't know but I was offended by it all. I feel very lucky to have a Newf at all. When my old girl dies she will probably be the last Newf I own as I don't qualify for a rescue. I am uninterested in puppies or breeders, I like the older dogs.
Three years ago I asked a rescue group about a Lab after my old Lab died of lymphoma. They never got back to me, and had very strict rules about e-mailing and times for replies, and that dog is still up for adoption. I on the other hand adopted a nice 9 year-old Lab from a shelter who is having a great life with us.
Years ago when looking for our first Newf, we went to a Newf breeder in Ontario and she made some snarky remarks about how we'd never get a Newf in our Honda Civic hatchback. We actually got TWO dogs in there, a Lab and a Newf, and we travelled around with them quite a bit, which they loved.
I found out later that her breeding dogs had heart problems that were passed on, so we made a lucky escape. There are ignorant adopters but there are also ignorant breeders.
You need to get to know people before adopting. It works both ways. We live in a society that loves "instant" and "fast" and adopting a dog needs time and an effort to get to know adopters or breeders and rescue groups.
I've known people, we all have, who matched every criteria for dog ownership and still treated their dogs abysmally, neglecting and chaining them or worse.
NinaA
New member
Wow. This is a good thread. Several years ago I tried to contact NCA rescue. I had a home for a Newf to replace my first Newf and I though rescue would be a good thing. I wasn't turned down, I was ignored. No response to any of my calls or emails. Now this was 20 years ago, so don't get riled. I posted on the message board (AOL Newfs) that I was in the market, but I couldn't reach the market. I was contacted by a person on the forum who knew a breeder in Georgia who had a pup -4-1/2 months - who needed a re-home. She came with baggage, we overcame it all, and we all loved her dearly for 13 years. I as so happy we were ignored. Having said all that, I may be "in the market" again soon for a rescue or a re-home, since both my Labs have been given only a short time. I will still start with the NCA rescue, as I think they are absolutely the best. After all these years of having from three to seven dogs in the house, I cannot imagine only one, and she's old, too. Even my neighbors tell us frequently that they can't imagine not having a Newf in the neighborhood. So, I will start the acceptance process, and I will have picture, letters of recommendation, vet records, phone references, etc. and I know that something good will happen.
dreamchaser456
New member
Having dealt with both reputable and not reputable rescues to get two of my newfs, I can honestly say that I would rather deal with reputable newf rescue any day! My first experience was with a legally defined tax expempt "rescue". While there was an application process, the only thing the person that "interviewed" me over the phone wanted to know was did I have cash. It seems they had "acquired" a litter of newf puppies at 4 weeks old. When I applied my girl was 16 weeks old according to the rescue, but she was actually about 6 months old, you could see every bone, weighed 30 lbs and was filthy and covered in fleas! After a vet check, she also had giardia that we battled for a few months. It's a good thing she was the only one left in that litter or I'd have really been broke! She was crated 24/7 at the "rescue" also so she was completely untrained, not house trained and very fearful. Bella is now 4.5 years, a therapy dog and almost fearless because she trusts us. She is very tiny from lack of proper food, about 70 lbs so she looks like a puppy.
My second experience was with another legally defined tax exempt rescue that was reputable! The application was lengthy, I had several interviews asking all sorts of questions about my experience with newfs, training, my current newfs, our family. My second adoption was a newf with some issues but from the beginning with the application it was a different experience.
I agree that not having a fenced yard shouldn't be a complete deal breaker for everyone but having worked in shelters and rescue you learn that far too often having to walk the dog becomes a chore and the dog ends up needing re-homed again. Some things "should" be able to worked on at times when it's the right dog and match. I can't imagine the problems that being shuttled around would have caused my boy but it's likely that had he not found the right home he would have been euthanized by now as he had "aggression problems".
Much like breeeders that have strict guidelines to be as certain as possible that this is a forever home, rescues need that just as much. I hope my next rescued newf and my next puppy come from very picky places so I know I'm the best home for them.
My second experience was with another legally defined tax exempt rescue that was reputable! The application was lengthy, I had several interviews asking all sorts of questions about my experience with newfs, training, my current newfs, our family. My second adoption was a newf with some issues but from the beginning with the application it was a different experience.
I agree that not having a fenced yard shouldn't be a complete deal breaker for everyone but having worked in shelters and rescue you learn that far too often having to walk the dog becomes a chore and the dog ends up needing re-homed again. Some things "should" be able to worked on at times when it's the right dog and match. I can't imagine the problems that being shuttled around would have caused my boy but it's likely that had he not found the right home he would have been euthanized by now as he had "aggression problems".
Much like breeeders that have strict guidelines to be as certain as possible that this is a forever home, rescues need that just as much. I hope my next rescued newf and my next puppy come from very picky places so I know I'm the best home for them.
Peter Maniate
New member
Spot on Paula - couldn't have said it better.
R Taft
Active member
I must admit I could not imagine my dogs without our well fenced garden/yard space.....we committed to having dogs, yes very expensive. We made a welded yard of about 1/4 acre that is attached to our west porch/verandah...totally newfie proof and puppy proof. We also have a 2 acre fenced garden. Again newfie proof, but it has a roadside fence so they are only out there when we are there too....Just in case
As i said i could not imagine my dogs being happy just always being on leash and walked...there is nothing more important to them to have the early morning and late evening tumble. And to be able to just lie on the lawn and keep an eye on the neighbourhood...to chase a bird, or a small mammal or go cricket hunting.......Tat to me is a complete dog life. I am not saying the ones who go with out do not have caring loving homes. But I cannot imagine my dogs wanting to be re-homed and not being able to be free.........Go in and out through the doggy door into their own yard, lie under the apple tree and chew apples, or choose to have a quick puddle in their little pool or even better go into the garden and go into the dam for a swim......It has cost us a lot and we actually moved about 15 years ago to a better "dogs" home.....With us it is all about the dogs...........And when i look for a newf home, I like to think freedom is a part of it, just becuase I know mine love it.
As i said i could not imagine my dogs being happy just always being on leash and walked...there is nothing more important to them to have the early morning and late evening tumble. And to be able to just lie on the lawn and keep an eye on the neighbourhood...to chase a bird, or a small mammal or go cricket hunting.......Tat to me is a complete dog life. I am not saying the ones who go with out do not have caring loving homes. But I cannot imagine my dogs wanting to be re-homed and not being able to be free.........Go in and out through the doggy door into their own yard, lie under the apple tree and chew apples, or choose to have a quick puddle in their little pool or even better go into the garden and go into the dam for a swim......It has cost us a lot and we actually moved about 15 years ago to a better "dogs" home.....With us it is all about the dogs...........And when i look for a newf home, I like to think freedom is a part of it, just becuase I know mine love it.