So today we went to the vet...

[LiquidBlue]

We took the doggies to the vet today because of Kuai Le's soft stools and the general flee battle we are fighting. The vet we like, I will call him Dr. A, wasn't in today, so we saw the first available vet, Dr. B.

I started to worry when, after a quick physical examination of Kuai Le, the vet said "So, lets decided how old this dog is..." What?? Seriously?? was all I could think...lets "Decided" how old she is??...all the paper work I have on her says that she was born 07/06/08, which makes her almost 7 months old. The vet said that based on the fact she has all of her adult teeth and that there is some tartar build up, he believes she is 9-12 months old, but that its "no big deal". I personally think it is a big deal because I was planning on getting her spayed based on her age (she has not had a heat cycle yet) and if she is 12 months old she is the worlds smallest newf...maybe she isn't even a newf??...Today she is 59 lbs and 23" at the shoulder. When we bought her, at an assumed 12 weeks, she was 23 lbs. When we saw Dr. A around 16 weeks she was 35 lbs. Dr. A never mentioned anything about her being MONTHS older than her records which, I would think, would be even more noticeable at 16 weeks than almost 7 months. Dr. A also said he detected a slight heart murmur, but that at her age he wasn't too concerned, it might just be from growing. Dr. B said nothing about the murmur.

I would really like some opinions from other newf owners and looking over old posts having pictures really helps. I tried to take some pics by myself, but they didn't turn out very well and my husband says there is nothing wrong with the dogs, but I am suffering from "too much information-itis". :smashy: Here are the pics I have, a few of her teeth and a few of her. I will try again with the pics later as she is napping.

Please let me know what you think and thank you!

Kuai Le @ 13 weeks:

 

[R Taft]

If you have papers surely they are correct, Where did you buy your puppy?................Are you able to contact the breeder? Size is not always the way to tell a newf. My Newf Annabelle is only 99lbs (at 18 months), which is small and she is definitly a newf. Though she was not well fed in part of her early life. Is Dr B familiar with Giant breeds? Tartar build-up at 9-12months should still not happen. I have older dogs (18 months, 3 years) that have never had tartar buid-up. It is one of the reasons we feed so many bones. There are even toys now that are good for teeth. Even our fourteen year old dog has the most beautiful white teeth. It is an odd way to age a dog. Maybe he looked at the molars and thought they were all fully complete. Though I think it would be hard to judge between 7months and 9months..............I would check your breeder and see your vet A

 

[Tug]

Can't stress how wonderful raw bones are!!!!

 

[Ursa]

Just for a size comparison - Fargo was born 07/08/08 so he and KL are both about 6 months old and he weighs 56 pounds and is approx 22 inches tall (he was squirmy so the height measurement isn't super accurate!!) His teeth look pretty much the same as Kuai Le's in terms of development. No tartar here either but we feed a lot of bones as well.

 

[Sound Bay Newfs]

If the paperwork is right, then your pup is 5 1/2 months old. That corresponds more with her weight and size too. But giant breed dogs can lose their baby teeth later, so the vet may have been checking for baby teeth that have not fallen out yet. You could try to contact your breeder, but I doubt if paperwork was switched, that they would not admit to that. Paperwork from puppy stores has been known to have fabricated information. She is young to be spayed anyway, so you could wait until she comes into season then spay after that.

 

[LiquidBlue]

Our dirty little secret is that Kuai Le is from a puppy store...its in the mall we take our daughter to to play and we always visit the puppies. We had to give our adopted dog back to the human society because, after 4 months he began to be was aggressive toward our daughter and we needed a new puppy. I wouldn't have purchased a dog from them, but Kuai Le had been there for four weeks and completely miserable and terrified the entire time (shaking whenever she was out of the cage). I did not want to support them by spending money there, but they kept marking her down and when she was 60% off I went ahead and bought her, thinking they were most likely taking a loss. They haven't gotten any other newfies since her (almost 3 months). I do know the breeders name, but when I googled their names the results were less than confidence inspiring.

Dr. A is familiar with Giant Breeds and owns Danes, which is why we like him so much.

If tarter is so easily removed/prevented it can't be that reliable of a gauge. And that is what he said he was basing his guess from. We tried bones with our AM Bulldog and it was a vomitous disaster, but I know more about picking out bones now, so I think I'll try again.

Thanks for the size comparisons R Taft and Ursa. Sound Bay, thanks for the advice about the heat cycle, I don't want to spay until she is older.

 

[wrknnwf]

Well even if she is a bit older, that's only a difference of 2 to 3 months. Everyone has a different opinion of the right age to spay but if you're off a couple of months, it won't make much difference. You don't have to spay her at any exact age. I think anywhere between 18 months to 2 years would be fine, so that's a lot of leeway.

Newfs are usually late bloomers though and some don't come into season the first time until they are over a year old, so that's not a reliable predictor of age either. Some have frequent heat cycles (like every 4 months for a while) and others less often (6 months). You might be able to use that as a loose gauge for when to spay.

And while we always caution about buying from pets stores, even if she did come from one, you love her and that's all that counts right now. So don't be embarrassed or feel like she doesn't measure up. She looks like a wonderful pet and you should be proud of her. You're among friends here so no secrets allowed. LOL

 

[Prdmary]

I agree totally with everything Jane said..........

Sounds like she is going to be a great dog for you and your family.......and she is lucky to have found such a loving family!

 

[Ursa]

She's lucky that she found you and your family who obviously care for her and are willing to put in the work that a puppy requires!

 

[zennewf]

And while we always caution about buying from pets stores, even if she did come from one, you love her and that's all that counts right now. So don't be embarrassed or feel like she doesn't measure up. She looks like a wonderful pet and you should be proud of her. You're among friends here so no secrets allowed. LOL

Yup!

 

[Liisa]

I completely understand why you took her in. She would have pulled at my heart as well. And she is a very cute girl... I'm glad she found her home with you.

 

[LiquidBlue]

:grouphug:

Thanks everyone. Kuai Le is a great dog for our family. Because she is from an unknown background I'm trying to be extra careful with preventative care. Its good to hear that there is a nice big window for safely getting her spayed. I want her to live a long healthy life...we have big plans (Okay, so I have big plans for her, she justs wants solid poops, lol )

 

[victoria1140]

just because she may not have come from the best of backgrounds doesn't matter, the fact that you obviously love and adore her does. I have seen some newfs who are adult and are just a bit bigger than a labrador so as with all breeds there can be variation. If unsure you could always ask for a second opinion

 

[BluwaterNewfs]

....Dr. A also said he detected a slight heart murmur, but that at her age he wasn't too concerned, it might just be from growing. Dr. B said nothing about the murmur.

I would be very concerned about the murmur. It could be caused by many things, such as SAS or a PDA, to name a few. Unless a cardiologist has examined her an deemed it a innocent murmur. Most murmurs as not innocent and need to monitored. They occur from 'growing'

 

[Erika]

And while we always caution about buying from pets stores, even if she did come from one, you love her and that's all that counts right now. So don't be embarrassed or feel like she doesn't measure up. She looks like a wonderful pet and you should be proud of her. You're among friends here so no secrets allowed. LOL
__________________
Our Gunther is from a pet store....He is the most wonderful, lovable and was the easiest to train out of all my Newfs and pyrs.What a beautiful baby you have.Heres Gunther

 

[LiquidBlue]

I will go back and see Dr. A and ask for a second opinion about her age and the murmer as well. I am concerned about the murmer. Dr. A said to bring her back at 6 months and then we could talk about what to do next, but Dr. B listened to her and didn't hear anything.

Gunther has the sweetest face...

 

[Prdmary]

Personally, I wouldn't trust any of MY general practitioners to diagnose a "murmur" vs something much more serious. I'd want a cardiologist to examine them and probably do an echo. I'd definitely want to know what's going on with the murmur BEFORE I put my dog under to be spayed. But that's just me.......

 

[Charlie'sMom]

keep in mind that often with PDA murmurs, that they get louder and more detectable as they close. There us the most turbulence and therefore more sound as they are in the process of closing

 

[BluwaterNewfs]

A PDA usally closes by 8-9 weeks old. Once in while they may take another few weeks. If not closed by 3 -4 months old, the cardiologist usually want to to close them surgically. Left open, they can cause problems as the dog matures.

 

[LiquidBlue]

Should I ask my vet for a reference for a cardiologist? We are a few hours away from the University of Florida College of Veterinary Medicine, which is where we have always taken our horses for surgery.