MsHarrysMom
New member
just thinking i could probably add some pumpkin too... at least he woke me up everytime he had to go out. could've been worse...
so aggravated at this whole thing! Suggestions??
- Thread starter 2ndchance
- Start date
new_2_newf
New member
Honestly, if TOTW is working, why not stay with it? If you don't want to toss it, just be super diligent about hand washing till that bin is empty (which with 2 plus a pup that can't take long). Once it's gone, sanitize the bin and scoops, wash up all bowls and dishes and beds and move forward with life. We've been fine here, although we were lucky enough to avoid any listed on the recall, and I can't say I'm looking to jump to another brand.
mulenag
New member
That's kinda my thought. Most dogs can handle a bit of salmonella without any effects. If you yourself prepare raw chicken at home for your own consumption you are already exposing yourself to salmonella. One of my FB friends said it best when she said to just treat the kibble like you would raw chicken and clean up after handling.
ElvisTheNewf
Active member
It took us about a full year before we got a handle on Elvis' allergies. His are 98% food related and his belly breaks out like crazy. We've had great luck with Blue Buffalo Lamb and Rice, which seems to be about the only meat/grain he can handle. He's so sensitive to beef/pork/chicken that we can't even give him a piece of plain grilled or boiled chicken we may use for dinner.
MsHarrysMom
New member
I think for now I will take over the dog feeding responsibilities (new puppy is my 10yr old daughters) and see how this all plays out. I really, really don't want to change foods now.
NewfieMama
New member
We've stopped using kibble as treats and only the adults in the house handle the food. Hands and surfaces washed after touching. And of course we're watching everyone for signs of illness.
Our 2 bags of Nature's Domain are not part of the recalled lot but they seem to have been produced after that lot, so I'll keep an eye on whether or not they're recalled. Hope not, this is the first food I've found that BOTH my dogs seem to be able to eat.
new_2_newf
New member
those all strike me as horribly logical, sane things to do 
2ndchance
New member
All but one dog out of 5 were licking and they are all related ~Father and his children~ but months after the change of food they were fine again. So I do believe it is allergies, but testing for the exact allergy is costly, once grains were cut out all was well with the world again. They also smelled like yeast, they had bad breath and once the food was changed that went away. Now the bad breath could have come from stomach upset from bad food.
My Diamond lot #'s were not on the recall list until just this week when all diamond food was recalled, but a week prior to the first recall, one dog was ill and stressed enough for me to make a last minute mad dash to the vet. They gave her something for pain because she could not lay down and it was concluded she had a bad tummy ache. At that time Diamond had not put anything out regarding recalls so none of us would have suspected that. I thought at that time it may have been the beginning of bloat only because she kept moving and was noticeably uncomfortable, though there was no dry heaving or heavy drooling, just lots of pacing and being uncomfortable . As the week passed I fed them as normal, but many would eat one day and not the next, they would lay by their food, but would not eat it . This was 4 out of 5 dogs. Then when I picked up the yard I found much diarrhea. toward the wooded part of the yard.
I had two bags of Diamond open and one bag of 4 health and they were mixed in the dogs dishes for variety and because I wanted them used to 4 health as sometimes the store did not always have the Diamond that I used.
I was trying to avoid stomach upset so I got them used to two foods, little did I know!
So that's why I attribute the food with grains to allergies, and why I do not and would not suggest to continue feeding a food that was recalled. No offense to anyone here, but I do answer dog questions all day and many people have written in about sick dogs over the last few months, symptoms A typical of salmonella, but no one knew about the recall yet and no one knew that there was an unopened bag of diamond tested back in Oct 2011.
Puppies and seniors cannot handle salmonella, not can human elderly, frail or young children, so to suggest that a dog can handle a small amount is not an answer I would give someone as a professional and this is why I get so angry because Dog foods are not recalled right away yet many humans touch it ,including kids, and become very ill. I would not want that in my home to take the chance whether I noticed my dog ill or not.
My Diamond lot #'s were not on the recall list until just this week when all diamond food was recalled, but a week prior to the first recall, one dog was ill and stressed enough for me to make a last minute mad dash to the vet. They gave her something for pain because she could not lay down and it was concluded she had a bad tummy ache. At that time Diamond had not put anything out regarding recalls so none of us would have suspected that. I thought at that time it may have been the beginning of bloat only because she kept moving and was noticeably uncomfortable, though there was no dry heaving or heavy drooling, just lots of pacing and being uncomfortable . As the week passed I fed them as normal, but many would eat one day and not the next, they would lay by their food, but would not eat it . This was 4 out of 5 dogs. Then when I picked up the yard I found much diarrhea. toward the wooded part of the yard.
I had two bags of Diamond open and one bag of 4 health and they were mixed in the dogs dishes for variety and because I wanted them used to 4 health as sometimes the store did not always have the Diamond that I used.
I was trying to avoid stomach upset so I got them used to two foods, little did I know!
So that's why I attribute the food with grains to allergies, and why I do not and would not suggest to continue feeding a food that was recalled. No offense to anyone here, but I do answer dog questions all day and many people have written in about sick dogs over the last few months, symptoms A typical of salmonella, but no one knew about the recall yet and no one knew that there was an unopened bag of diamond tested back in Oct 2011.
Puppies and seniors cannot handle salmonella, not can human elderly, frail or young children, so to suggest that a dog can handle a small amount is not an answer I would give someone as a professional and this is why I get so angry because Dog foods are not recalled right away yet many humans touch it ,including kids, and become very ill. I would not want that in my home to take the chance whether I noticed my dog ill or not.
jane
New member
I agree!!! My Merlin had bad stool before I switched him to raw. My bichon, Sassy, used to eat her paws before I switched to raw.
new_2_newf
New member
I don't opt for the alarmist approach on much in my life. The symptoms of salmonella poisoning are unfortunately common, in short mild to severe GI upset.
To keep feeding your dogs a food that is clearly not working for them would be foolish, recall or otherwise. Aside from that, not all food recalled is contaminated. Would I send back a bag on the list? Yes. Am I going to never feed another product that's been touched by diamond? No.
Through this I've continued to feed TOTW because I've not had a reason to stop. My dog is not showing any signs of GI distress and I've always washed my hands and his bowls after use and handling. The simple fact is dogs DO digest things VERY differently than humans do. In the absence of a compromised situation (someone who is already ill or immunodeficiency) , thorough hygiene practices that suffice for raw chicken are going to be enough to keep the average person safe.
If you want to keep running around screaming that they sky is falling, that's your bag. At the end of the day, you need to do what you think is best for your family (fur included). I'm just getting tired of the fear mongering and widely thrown generalizations. Recalls happen. Take the information and make an informed decision about what is best for you and your family.
Jeannie
Super Moderator
Very well said.
Jeannie
Super Moderator
In all my experience with allergies (and I have a lot) if a dog is licking and itching it is usually an enviromental allergy NOT food. Allergies usually are genetic. You stated 'months after' they were better. Did you stop to think that the enviromental allergy season had changed? Like a frost or maybe the trees quit budding? There are lots of enviroment allergies that change throughout the year.
Signs of a food allergy is ear and anal gland problems. My vet always says usually food is ears and rears, enviromental is itching and licking.
2ndchance
New member
As I stated above I work daily with dog questions~ this includes health, I work with many vets and am aware of symptoms of all of the above mentioned. I am not a fear monger, nor do I run around like the sky is falling, I have lived through salmonella poisoning and know exactly what it can do to the body, Diamond has always been my food of choice for the last 8 years, and I know full well the signs of allergies in dogs , seasonal, food, and contact , including ear infections though I did not mention all symptoms here.
Salmonella can cause mild GI upset in some dogs but can also cause more than just GI upset in pups and senior dogs, (mine are all senior) depending on how much contamination is in one bag of food and the overall health of the dog. All I am stating is that I do not trust that dog food companies will fully disclose any potential health hazard until it is absolutely necessary. These disclosures happen more when humans are affected and CDC must get involved. The bag of food was found to be contaminated last October but we heard nothing until now.
I have to wonder what the consensus would be when we had the melamine debacle and everyone was was thinking at first it was aflatoxin, then that proved not to be the problem. Then there were no answers for a while and dogs were still dying, but when children started dying because of it, that is when the companies took it more seriously and things moved ahead more quickly and rightfully so.
How does one know for sure that Salmonella is the only problem with the foods? We only know that's what they were tested for. Common sense after the China mishap makes me think ahead and prepare whenever there is a recall of any product. By the way, with the China debacle, the brand of Diamond I used was one of the non affected foods so I did not discontinue its use. So I am not anti Diamond or any other food, I am pro keeping my dog's health the best that I can manage to do whatever circumstances arise and I am not by nature a risk taker, or one who will believe whatever a higher official tells me to be truth, but I am one who prepares for those that do take risks or those that tell untruths and in this case it was the dog food company that took the risk to continue to sell products they may very well have known to be problematic. I would not put my children at such a risk and I will not put my dogs through such a risk.
My objective was to make you think and keep a watchful eye over your pets behavior through this ordeal as dogs do not always show illness in the same that humans do.
How do we know Salmonella causes just a little GI upset? Did your dog tell you that or did a human tell you that? Because when I had it my body felt it had been run over by a Mac Truck ~similar to bad flu symptoms, so why does one automatically think that their dog may not feel the same? Dogs by nature are stoic and do not gripe and whine like humans do and it is not until we see a limp do we know something is wrong, but then say, " well, he doesn't seem to have pain because he does not cry when I press here." The very nature of his limp is saying loudly, I have Pain! Why do we automatically trust what humans say about our pets regardless of their background and study. I had one person go to the same office for the same problem with their dog, the first vet said the dog should be put down or it would bleed out and in a sense told the family that "you don't want your children to find their dog dead at home do you?"
The second Vet in that very same office/practice said, "oh it could be years before you see a problem"
The dog, which according to the first vet should have been put down right away is now years later still up and about.
IF they recalled a Baby formula and you knew though it was not the formula you fed your baby but it was a product of the same company that made the recalled formula would you still take the chance?
We say we love our pets, we say we treat them as if they are our children, but do we really? Aren't we more likely to take a risk with the family pet, but not that same risk with the human
family members.
There are always risks and risk takers in life, but it's how you prepare for them that may make the difference in your own personal life.
This is all I am asking, is that you question what you are told and then go with your gut.
Salmonella can cause mild GI upset in some dogs but can also cause more than just GI upset in pups and senior dogs, (mine are all senior) depending on how much contamination is in one bag of food and the overall health of the dog. All I am stating is that I do not trust that dog food companies will fully disclose any potential health hazard until it is absolutely necessary. These disclosures happen more when humans are affected and CDC must get involved. The bag of food was found to be contaminated last October but we heard nothing until now.
I have to wonder what the consensus would be when we had the melamine debacle and everyone was was thinking at first it was aflatoxin, then that proved not to be the problem. Then there were no answers for a while and dogs were still dying, but when children started dying because of it, that is when the companies took it more seriously and things moved ahead more quickly and rightfully so.
How does one know for sure that Salmonella is the only problem with the foods? We only know that's what they were tested for. Common sense after the China mishap makes me think ahead and prepare whenever there is a recall of any product. By the way, with the China debacle, the brand of Diamond I used was one of the non affected foods so I did not discontinue its use. So I am not anti Diamond or any other food, I am pro keeping my dog's health the best that I can manage to do whatever circumstances arise and I am not by nature a risk taker, or one who will believe whatever a higher official tells me to be truth, but I am one who prepares for those that do take risks or those that tell untruths and in this case it was the dog food company that took the risk to continue to sell products they may very well have known to be problematic. I would not put my children at such a risk and I will not put my dogs through such a risk.
My objective was to make you think and keep a watchful eye over your pets behavior through this ordeal as dogs do not always show illness in the same that humans do.
How do we know Salmonella causes just a little GI upset? Did your dog tell you that or did a human tell you that? Because when I had it my body felt it had been run over by a Mac Truck ~similar to bad flu symptoms, so why does one automatically think that their dog may not feel the same? Dogs by nature are stoic and do not gripe and whine like humans do and it is not until we see a limp do we know something is wrong, but then say, " well, he doesn't seem to have pain because he does not cry when I press here." The very nature of his limp is saying loudly, I have Pain! Why do we automatically trust what humans say about our pets regardless of their background and study. I had one person go to the same office for the same problem with their dog, the first vet said the dog should be put down or it would bleed out and in a sense told the family that "you don't want your children to find their dog dead at home do you?"
The second Vet in that very same office/practice said, "oh it could be years before you see a problem"
The dog, which according to the first vet should have been put down right away is now years later still up and about.
IF they recalled a Baby formula and you knew though it was not the formula you fed your baby but it was a product of the same company that made the recalled formula would you still take the chance?
We say we love our pets, we say we treat them as if they are our children, but do we really? Aren't we more likely to take a risk with the family pet, but not that same risk with the human
family members.
There are always risks and risk takers in life, but it's how you prepare for them that may make the difference in your own personal life.
This is all I am asking, is that you question what you are told and then go with your gut.
Last edited:
2ndchance
New member
Truth is that a dogs system is very much like a human's system, they do not digest things differently though there are things humans can take that may cause problems to dogs such as medication , but you are talking about the digestion of food, not medication and I have had sick dogs in the weeks prior though the product I was using was NOT on the recall list. Coincidence? I think not. Now Diamond is recalling all SKUS, does that not make you wonder why?
Jeannie
Super Moderator
Where did you get this info? On the offical site from Diamond this is not stated
http://diamondpetrecall.com/
My distributor has kept in close contact witih all their retailers. Today I received my order of TOW with no problems or worries since my distributor is not getting any of the recalled product.
I am not going to stop feeding TOW Pacific Stream to my dogs. If anything, I'd think right now and in the future any of the recalled food will be the safest to feed as close tabs will be kept on the manufacturer.
Example, about a year ago the health dept closed a local restuarant because of a violation (they were storing meat above the veggies in the cooler) After they opened so many people stated they were not eating there. DUH...don't you think the health dept. was on their butts and they kept everything in tip top shape? I'd think the same for the dog food companies/manufacturers.
I am hearing all over the web that 'raw is looking better'. Well one mistake and your dog could be in danger. In fact even our own food can be in danger. Nothing is 100% except death and taxes and I question taxes!
new_2_newf
New member
You write a blog. That's it. Anyone can write a blog.
You have experienced salmonella poisoning in a human, so have I, and it's no walk in the park I'll agree with you there, but did I stop eating chicken? No, I did not.
Symptoms of Salmonella Poisoning:
Salmonellosis in dogs and cats:
The severity of salmonellosis in dogs and cats varies:
http://www.vetmed.wisc.edu/pbs/zoonoses/gik9fel/salmonella.html
subclinical carrier state (most common)
acute enterocolitis
fever, anorexia, lethargy
diarrhea, possibly with mucus or blood
abdominal pain (infection is often associated with mesenteric lymphadenitis)
Cats may present with prolonged periods of fever and anorexia without diarrhea.
septicemia/endotoxemia
Salmonellosis in cats has also been caused "song bird fever," reflecting association with predation on infected migratory birds.
Just exactly how dogs digestion is different from humans:
http://www.three-little-pitties.com/dog-digestive-system.html
http://www.three-little-pitties.com/dog-digestive-tract.html
As for the rest of your comments, back them up with some resources or go get a medical degree. Yes, I trust the educated professional options over yours. Sorry. My dog's health is absolutely my priority, which is why I check into the facts behind options put out there on the web by random people that may or may not be presenting fact or their own opinions. If fact checking and research makes me a risk taker in your book, so be it. I'd rather be educated and aware than uneducated and making assumptions about things I know little about.
Last edited:
victoria1140
Active member
can I suggest everyone takes a really deep breath at the moment as this thread seems to be getting a litle personal.
the otiginal question was any suggestions on foods that may be used as an alternative due to the problems posed by Diamond products.
Also enviromental allergies can cause stomach inbalances and physical problems internally as much as externally as Beaus enviromental allergies are the highest ones that pinged back from his tests. It may not be as common but the specialist dealing with Beau has seen a rise in enviromental allergies giving a whole array of varying symptoms.
Now apart from Champion pet foods are there any other non grain types that are not manufactured by Diamond pet foods that can be used as alternatives.
the otiginal question was any suggestions on foods that may be used as an alternative due to the problems posed by Diamond products.
Also enviromental allergies can cause stomach inbalances and physical problems internally as much as externally as Beaus enviromental allergies are the highest ones that pinged back from his tests. It may not be as common but the specialist dealing with Beau has seen a rise in enviromental allergies giving a whole array of varying symptoms.
Now apart from Champion pet foods are there any other non grain types that are not manufactured by Diamond pet foods that can be used as alternatives.