Inbreeding

[Sun Valley]

Also, where the hair on the head is so long...that it's standing out like a halo. (I would have to re-read your standard on that point..I don't remember if head hair is even mentioned in your standard, but it is in ours.)

Some of my girls have long hair on their head and some don't...that is something that isn't mentioned in our standard...

The girls with lots of fluff on their heads get it trimmed.

Like Lynn said, I don't know of any breeder who breeds for coat...I certainly don't want more coat then I already have!... Most of my girls have short dense coats with lots of undercoat.

LA

 

[ardeagold]

Speaking of the floof on the head ... does anyone know how that originated? I mean when it first appeared ... where did it come from?

I know that breeders HATE the round eyes. I've heard that from so many. I don't hate them ... they tend to give an eternally cute puppy look, but I know that they're not correct. I really dislike drooping eyes. They remind me of a Bloodhound, and they've got to create problems in the water, or with irritation from dirt, dust, in general.

 

[Sound Bay Newfs]

Speaking of the floof on the head ... does anyone know how that originated? I mean when it first appeared ... where did it come from?

Floof is not a hairdo actually, but is there because of the shape of the head of the dog. You will find that a dog with floof has a point on the top of it's head, which makes the hair stand up. A dog with the flat look, has a flat head to match.

 

[newfy]

Floof is not a hairdo actually, but is there because of the shape of the head of the dog. You will find that a dog with floof has a point on the top of it's head, which makes the hair stand up. A dog with the flat look, has a flat head to match.

I just checked, my Merlin is a Floof king & has the point you are talking about, Tiki has the flater head with the flat look to match. What causes this? Alot of people who pet Merlin comment about the shape to his head when they pet him, like they think it is not normal; he is often referred to as the "Rock Star".

 

[ardeagold]

Lynn...

Are you referring to the bone in the back of the skull? The occiput? They all have that, some more pronunced than others.

None of mine have a point where the two sides of the skull meet on the top of the head. In fact, that area is flat in all of them, with an indentation in the middle (which they love rubbed).

Some have floof (Cole and Frankie), Addie has minimal floof, Molly, Mira and Chance, have no floof.

I suspect it's something to do with the coat...but not sure what... or when it appeared in the breed, or how.

 

[Pipelineozzy]

No, the floof I am talking about has nothing to do with the well developed occipital bone that a Newf is supposed to have

 

[janices]

I also cannot STAND the round buggy eyes...and there are WAY too many of them here in Canada too. (Also saggy eyes...ewww.) And yes, our standard ALSO calls for a muzzle that is smooth and free of wrinkles. We differ in that we still do not put dropped incisors as being a minor deviation (and I actually agree with that not being in there, simply because I think the mouths are getting worse in the breed instead of better, and with a dental background..it makes sense to me that when the incisors are out of alignment...the rest of the teeth will follow eventually...esp when those mouths are bred together.) And because we don't recognize brown or grey...there is no mention of accepting a lighter eye either.
The coats I am referring to are coats where the body coat is more like the pantaloons and feathers...excessively long..not moderately long... and these coats do not fall back into place when brushed forward..simply because they are too long. I cannot find a reason in my mind to "justify" breeding more coat in...there is no advantage to the dog or it's purpose. Also, where the hair on the head is so long...that it's standing out like a halo. (I would have to re-read your standard on that point..I don't remember if head hair is even mentioned in your standard, but it is in ours.)

What I've seen teeth are out of alignment. Alignment is off. More than just dropped incisors. Bites seem to be getting worse to me too. Same on coat, excessively long. Doesn't fall back in place like it should. One's who have it have to do excessive trimming on the coats.

We have dropped incisors in pyr standard, not a deviation, which hasn't been a problem with the bites there when occur.

 

[newflizzie]

This has been very interesting and informative. As a newbie newf puppy buyer especially, and as someone with no breeding experience in any breed.

I went out looking for a newf that was sound in health and temperament (I would think that's what most do). I wouldn't say I am experienced enough to say there is a split between show and working dogs, but I do see a difference in say, styles. Not sure I can convey what I mean. As I did more and more research I realized I wanted a working dog - I've never been that interested in showing in conformation - so when I saw there was VN title I started looking more into the lines of those dogs as a dog who could "do it all" appealed to me and seemed more how I see a newf to be. Anyway, as a newbie it's all just a maze anyway and I did the best I could with what I could figure out.

The discussion of genetics on breeding newfs has been interesting - and man, I give y'all credit, so complicated! Someone or some people mentioned a limited newf gene pool or something along those lines, etc and how it gets complicated - the lines going back and forth from the US to Europe etc. For years and years, I've sat for umpteen hours listening to basenji breeders go back and forth on genetics. As they are a breed that is still "indigenous" to the Congo and every 20 years or so the B Club of America allows African Stock to be introduced into the US breeding programs and tracked (in the hopes of keeping the breed healthy etc without changing the standard or introducing a genetic nightmare). You can imagine the outcrossing discussions being beaten over the head there. Breeding to a total unknown. So, I've known many people in other breeds who say off hand how they would love to have an unlimited gene pool (haven't known enough newf people to have heard it yet here) but let me tell you how utterly not-a-picnic it is for basenji breeders. It, for the most part, is a positive thing - but is also extremely complicated as all you breeders can probably imagine.

Anyway, just throwing it out there as I find the whole thing interesting and giving the responsible breeders out there a thumbs up for trying to figure it all out and do the best they can...

 

[twright1231]

Well said Anne. I, too, have really enjoyed this thread.

 

[Ohana Mom]

I too have enjoyed this thread. I agree that I don't really know any breeders breeding for coat. I think some lines have more coat than others - but I don't think it's something one seeks out. My God - who would want more???
Of our three - we have 3 different coats. They are all 3 related but Iz and Lani are the closest is relation (she is his niece) and their coats are similar. He has more of it for sure - but Lani is more "wash & wear". Lilo even before her spay carried tremendous coat. It never really blew on it's own - you'd have to really pull it out with a comb when it let go.
But all 3 of ours have tremendous working drive. They each seem to love different things - but in the end - even though we have a lot of coat, and are definitely more "today's type" - they certainly can still work like Newfs!