People hitting my puppy & kids

[LeahO]

So, lovely Easter Dinner with my 6 month old Ben turned sour.

He's a big clumsy thing and my niece (about 3 years old) likes to yell at him and make her chase him. This made me nervous and I would keep telling Ben 'no' (but no one said anything about my niece and usually people think I have too much attention on the pup). So, of course, he knocks her down having great fun with the screaming rolly-polly and thinks we're still playing when she's scared.

Suddenly, the room erupts. Grandpa springs from his chair and starts hitting Ben, yanking him up by the collar and "submitting" him roughly. Brother in law races over saying "He bit her!"

Ben ran away once let up out of his submission. (and of course didn't bite her, nor did he ever nip at her as claimed afterward - he licks everything) At present we're back home and he's laying in the kitchen away from me, which he never does.

Here he's disciplined with "Time Outs" which are pretty traumatic for him as he has to be alone in a dark room away from me and interesting things. This is followed by an "I'm sorry" lick and sulking for 20-30 minutes. He also knows what this word means and that it spells trouble if he keeps doing whatever he's doing. I don't hit him or knock him down.

Most people I know think I'm an idiot and that a dog needs to be smacked.

This isn't the first time he's been hit by a stranger. My father in law (other side) didn't like him barking at him so he yelled at him to stop barking in an elaborate sentence. Genius. What exactly does he think a puppy interprets that as? 'You bark too?? Let's play then!!' This ended in a swift couple of swats and me feeling like "wait, did you just hit my kid... ur dog?"

Ben knows basic commands, quiet, focus (when I want him to pay attention to what I want), off, etc and wants to please. He has a will, of course, so "come" has been tough for the boy at times. He gets time outs for that lately. I guess if I just punched him, he'd start coming faster.

Anyway. I'm left feeling divided - do I somehow get him totally unexcited about children by supersaturation via letting him go at random school recesses surprising the small task force of unsuspecting recess staff as he bowls for children?
Do I rent-a-kid to run past him daily?
Or perhaps I should just avoid kids all together until he's 3 years old and less excitable.

Since I think of him like my baby, I was unprepared to deal with people hitting him. In the instance when kids and untrusting parents are involved... well, what can you do?

They all were casual about it later and encouraged me to bring the pup over to "socialize him" (with intermittent beatings no doubt), but I don't like my dog cowering under iron fists. I'd much rather have a dog that does what I say because he hates to disappoint me. In this case, he's simply learning and a stern time out would have given him more of a lesson than panic against rage. I doubt he knows what happened. He's not aggressive or rough - just large and unaware of his body.

Kids and clumsy Newfoundland pups - what say you?

I now realize that I'll have to sternly tell people how to treat my dog, but in the instance that a child is involved, scared people take priority over any dog.

What a craptastic incident.

LeahO

 

[LeahO]

Oh - and I'm asking here in particular because Newfoundlands are not German Shepards. Grandpa raised dogs growing up, but they were definitely not Newfies.

 

[Wash]

The second anyone hit my dog I would explode, I dont care who it was.

As for the kids and the dog part. Its always best to make sure that the kid, the kids parents, and you discuss that the dog is a puppy and its probably not a good idea for any kind of chase type games. Instead teach the puppy to sit and the toddler to pet nice.

 

[baloobear2]

Leah I am so sorry this happened to you and your sweet Ben :hugs:

I think sometimes people don't realize how developmentally young a 6 month old NEWFY puppy really is. First no one but you or your spouse have the right to discipline your puppy! Of course unless it's a life and danger situation 2) While yes you should keep working with Ben on how to be around little ones and such, I think you need to say when you get to a family event: "I know everyone wants to play with the puppy, direct and talk to your niece too that is three and say, I want to teach you a game that Ben likes to play but he needs a special friend to play with... Maybe it's a ball or hide and seek. Make it clear to everyone that you are working with Ben and you don't want anymore of the kind of rough play that took place at Easter AND in the future please don't discipline my dog, I need to be the alpha and will take care of him" I would only allow play time for short amounts of time so he doesn't become over stimulated too. Newfies love people, kids attention and want to be apart of that, and that's okay for a while but then they need a quiet time to regroup. Maybe a chew bone or nyla bone to keep him busy.

I hope your able to resolve this, I know how much that can hurt when your family "blames the big dog" we've had that before but after we implemented some rules it really did help on family outings. Heck I had a sister in law that thought because Baloo was so laid back that he should tolerate her 6 yr old daughter pulling his ears like they were some sort of rope!! I stopped that short order and made her sit on the couch and comforted Baloo and told him what a good boy he was...Mom just thought it was funny and he should be able to with stand that GGGRRRR! I hope this helps you and your Ben, he sounds so sweet

 

[luvxl k 9]

My grandkids and their parents know they don't hit my dogs for any reason. The only one allowed to rough house with Cole is Shannon (27 year old daughter) because she knows what she's in for and loves it anyway. I am so with Wash, I would have exploded big time. I'm also with MB in that the 3 year old shouldn't be allowed to play with Ben, but just sit quietly with him, petting or playing ball. If my grandkids start running they are quickly stopped and told in no uncertain terms what will happen if they continue to try to get the dogs to chase them. Yes even the 2 and 3 year olds. After told that the 120+ pounds dogs will just love to jump on top of them and kiss their faces all over after they fall down, I really haven't had much trouble with any of them.

 

[Jorge's mum]

How awful!! I think you need to learn from this and if ever in a situation like that again don't be afraid to tell the kids/parents that they are not on either, I would also be telling grandpa that what he did is simply not on as you don't want him to think he can whollop your boy again in the future, if they can't control the child and their hands and back you up when you told your bear to calm ....then I am afraid I would not put your boy in a situation like that again as this sort of thing can do alot of damage to a pup..it would be no more visiting with him ...I would have been so pizzed off ! I would have a chat with all involved and make my feelings known, you also need to get your boy around nice experiences with people ..men etc ASAP so he has some positive association big hugs good luck x

 

[4ondafloor]

I agree with Karen 100%. I have four newfs, Syd is 3.5, Gojie is 3 and Pae is two. We won't factor MissM in the equation because she's almost 11 and doesn't romp much BUT.....My 5 year old grandson has grown up around the dogs. He knows he's not allowed to run in the house because that elicits rambunctious play time. He usually sits and plays tug with a toy or keep away where he hides a toy and they try to find it.
Outside if he wants to run and happens to get bumped or accidentally knocked over, his Mom ususally tells him to shake it off, he started it. (ha)
I'm not defending your grandpa here..I don't believe that hitting am animal solicits anything but fear.
Still, Grandpa grew up in a different time and dogs were treated differently then. Rather than get mad at Grandpa, use it as a chance to educate him about the breed and WHY they are treated differently. I'll bet Grandpa ends up with a better outlook the next time the child and pup get together.

 

[charlieinnj]

Wow.....I feel SO sorry for Ben.

My advice to you is in the future, especially when kids are around, I'd keep him on a leash and by your side. Keep his focus on you and no one else. Then, he won't get into trouble.

When he was younger, my Oliver could go from zero-to-wildman in 10 seconds. My mom has had double knee replacements and at the time, I couldn't risk his excitement knocking her down. So, when visitors came to the house, he was on a leash and by my side all the time.

 

[Bailey Boy]

I wouldn't set Ben up to fail and taking him back to your parents house in my opinion will only confirm to them you approve of their actions. Children also need to be taught how to respect animals, I don't approve nor do I tolerate kids pulling ears, tail or hitting one of mine just because they allow it.

This family gathering would have been a great time to train/teach both puppy and child instead the child learns it is ok to hit a dog and the pup learns he will be man handled for reasons unknown to him. I would let your family know why you won't be bringing Ben around in the future instead I would take him to parks and dog friendly stores encourage his sit before petting in a positive environment as already suggested. Doesn't matter if he is a baby, adult or a senior he trusts that you will always keep him safe.

 

[KodysGrandma]

I wasn't quite sure whose house this was and to me that matters a little in the approach. Your house- they ALL--- parents, your siblings etc. get strict orders that they do NOT touch your dog, your nieces and nephews if any do NOT run around the dog etc. etc. Someone else's house is a little harder but you can ask (as opposed to order in your house) that they not discipline him. Keep him close to you with a leash as Charlieinnj suggests or if possible bring a crate for another room when there is too much activity. Just be certain the kids can't get in there and tease him through the bars when no adult is watching. That happened through a fence to my collie when I was a child and made her really dislike kids of a certain age. And yes definitely use it as "teachable moments". Lastly if they won't cooperate (and some people simply won't) then I would either leave my puppy home (depending on time involved) or not go. That's harsh and hard but it wouldn't be for too many months and in the longer run much better for Ben's state of mind and yours. People can be such pains in the ----

 

[NewfieMama]

The second anyone hit my dog I would explode, I dont care who it was.

As for the kids and the dog part. Its always best to make sure that the kid, the kids parents, and you discuss that the dog is a puppy and its probably not a good idea for any kind of chase type games. Instead teach the puppy to sit and the toddler to pet nice.

This. It's as much about teaching the kids as it is about teaching the dog. We regularly walk to the park up the street and hang out near the playground so the dogs are always exposed to the sights and sounds of kids playing. Sometimes parents ask if they can bring their kids out to say hi to the dogs, and if the parents don't say anything to the kids, I start out with some instruction...you always ask first, approach quietly, let him sniff your hand, THEN gently pet. Don't jerk back (he won't bite, but he might kiss!), don't squeal. (Many, many parents seem to welcome this and talk to their kids about it, if they don't, they seem very open to me doing it - my dog, maybe they don't know dogs, but they appreciate that I'm looking out for their kids' safety).

I also find that it's necessary to protect my dogs from kids...I've had kids try to shove straws in Cooper's mouth, feed them things from the ground (rocks etc.) so I watch kids with an eagle eye and I assume they don't know how to be around dogs.

The other day we were at the park with both dogs and my 7 year old daughter. A group of teen girls came over and were petting/admiring the dogs, then a couple of their teen boy friends came THUNDERING over and fell onto the ground, wrestling RIGHT next to us. Zuzu thought this looked like great fun and I had to hang on TIGHT as she strained to jump into the fray. Because they were bigger girls and seemingly comfortable with dogs, they were not afraid, but I spoke to the boys about always approaching quietly because you never know what a dog might do if you frighten it/make it think you are threatening it or its people. The girls jokingly said we should have just let Zuzu jump on them - 'that would teach them!'. LOL.

Absolutely, positively, zero tolerance for anyone striking or otherwise disciplining my dogs. Your niece needs to learn how to behave around dogs, and your family needs to respect your rules - otherwise I'd head for parks on leash with lots of high value treats and a drool rag, and have some fun!

 

[Windancer]

I haven't even read the thread comments..I was so livid at reading the initial post...
People have been asked to leave my house for being harsh on my dogs...let alone hitting them...A six month old puppy percieves children as litter mates to be played with. It really has nothing to do with training, especially when the 'puppy' is inviting play....unless you want to totally quash his personality... The only mistake you made was taking him in the first place, and not having him crated,,,a relatives 'child' is not a good play toy.. That poor puppy is going to grow up with a warped personality if you do that...He has no clue why these humans brought pain on him....grrrr

 

[Erika]

so sorry you and Ben went threw this...........we dont see or associate with half our relatives simply becuase they dont know how to act or treat dogs. They think Im nutz and I think they are dysfuntional weirdos:shrug:........If they ever hit my dog.....Id go psycho. We are older 57 to be exact so it dont matter if we alienate family but I hope your situation works out. If most kids and old folks behaved as well as all our dogs the world would be a better place.:hugs: Hugs to Ben!!!!!!:hugs:

When I rescued my 5 3 newfs and 2 Pyrs , I promised them they would never feel pain or anger from anyone......kept the promise and dont have to deal with my pink haired sis in law:shocker::crazy: no more.....HA HA HA HA


I tell folks if ya cant respect and beloving with my dogs dont come and visit..as for hitting my dogs......yep Id be in the slammer . GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

 

[janices]

Do you have a crate? Puppy should have been in crate. Puppy has lots of training to still go through to know this is unacceptable at 6 mos. Best to just put puppy up in crate and tell kids if you can't be nice to puppy you will not play at all. Parents should be disciplining their kids. Just put puppy up. End of story.

Now that this has happened work on positive interactions with people for awhile. Puppy kindergarten would be good.

 

[CMDRTED]

I do not know your relationship with your relatives. So I will preface this with some people have a great relationship with their relatives, and some don't Remember, you can't choose your relatives.

I would have a conversation with them. I would explain to the Grandfather that striking a dog is not an acceptable option, regardless of how he has treated dogs in the past. If he cannot keep his hands to himself, you will have to re-evaluate your relationship and contact with him, as you will not stand for any violent contact with your puppy. You will need to make sure that he understands. He he gives tyou the, "This is my house........." then explain to him that when you leave you will not be back, since you and your "family" do not feel welcome, nor your wishes respected. You will have to stick to it, as if you cave he wins.

As far as the children are concerned, you've received some very good advice on that. You will also have to commmunicate to the parents that Newfoundlands are non-agressive dogs, and they can frre frre to look it up on the internet if they do not wish to believe you. If they wish to ensure that any "knock down incident do not occur again, it will take their cooperation. While it is your dog, it is their child, and they are responsible for their child's actions and activities. If you explain that while the child might think it's a fun thing, it is easily misinterpreted by the dog, and you do not want the dog chased, and the parents need to enforce it.

JMHO and 2 cents. Sorry you had to experience this.

 

[Henrys Mom]

I think from all of the responses you now see how closely you need to supervise your dog while around children. It is our responsibility as owners to keep our dogs safe. It is a natural instinct for a puppy to chase a child but it is your responsibility to not let this happen. I keep my pup on a leash if he is around small children, or really any children. I do not have a small child but I do have a 13 year old boy who loves to play basketball. I take Mason out because he too loves to play basketball, but at some point he always starts to chase my son and I have to put a stop to it. I keep him on a leash and correct him to NOT chase my son. He will get it one day, but as of now 4 month old Mason still chases my son. I tell him to chase the ball not the boy! A puppy has to be taught. While I would never allow an adult to hit my dog, I agree with Debra in that the grandfather is from a different generation. He needs to be taught how you want your dog to be treated. I hope everything works out for the best!

 

[TerriW]

I am with Windancer. I couldn't even finish reading YOUR post. I would NEVER EVER EVER take your puppy around those *****s again. EVER. Get a dog sitter, put him in a kennel, even for a day, even at your house (unless you can be sure they will never touch him again).

I hope they did not just create a dog who will nip in fear whenever a man is around.

So sad for your pup. So sad for the kids being raised there, to think that's how you treat a PUPPY.

 

[TerriW]

I just have to add: whenever I have a house full of relatives, I tend to drop the dog off to be groomed for the day. I can't watch everyone and I don't know who thinks it's funny to tease, hit, pull, or otherwise harm the pup.

********! I am so angry for you.

 

[NewfDad]

I think you have gotten good advice on handling the your dog side. The one thing that raises my concern and that I would have a talk with folks about is that they are raising a child to get very badly bitten some day. If the child were to act the way she did with your pup to a fearful larger dog she will get hurt. One can never assume that folks with potentially dangerous dogs will properly handle and supervise them.

 

[Bojie]

The story about how your pup was abused made me so angry, I'm not going to comment on it.

What I will tell you, is that I have 13 nieces and nephews and *most* of them (the ones we don't live near) are scared of dogs due to lack of exposure. Around ANY of my nieces and nephews (ranging from 2yrs to 17yrs old), they know the rules are no running, screaming, pulling of hair or ears or "riding" or jumping on my dogs. These rules are set before they ever see them. My dogs are ALWAYS on leash (less than 3ft) and next to me at all times when children are around, if I'm in a position that I can't keep my attention on them, they're in a crate or in the car. Even Bojie who is a certified therapy dog. I don't want to set my dogs up for failure, have a kid say "he bit me", strengthen the fear of dogs in my nieces or nephews, or have my dogs get hurt. During holidays, and family dinners, Bojie has always been on leash, in a "settle" at my feet with the leash under my leg or butt, or foot. Sure he's allowed to occasionally get up and change position, but never visits with other family members at the table or follows the children to play with them. In fact, he is usually the best behaved "child" at the table, with better manners than the human children have.

Take this experience as a HUGE learning experience. It's much harder to train humans than dogs. I'd avoid bringing him around any family from now on, and especially any family functions. To prevent him being fearful of men, humans etc. Bring him to places where there are people that you know LOVE dogs- petsmart, dog food stores, Home Depot, Lowes, walking parks, etc. Let him visit with as many people as possible and get love and attention from as many people there that he can meet. Children go to those stores too, let him get comfortable seeing them there. Walk him past playgrounds where kids are screaming and running etc. Keep him on a tight leash next to you and treat him if he's heeling nicely and staying calm, or sitting and watching next to you and not pulling. There are tons of things you can do to desensitize him. A few times a week, with lots of treats can really reinforce positive behavior.