Arrythmias, VPCs

takemebacktotulsa

takemebacktotulsa

New member
Anyone have any experience? While under for his neutering/pexi a couple of weeks ago, Willis had a few irregular heartbeats. The thought was it was due to anesthesia, but we did an EKG this week to be on the safe side. He had 18 VPCs in one minute, so they wanted an echocardiogram. Structure looked good on the echo and they found nothing that would cause the VPCs so they sent out blood sample for a troponin. We're waiting on those results and will either check for diseases or run another EKG in a few weeks, depending upon results.

Is it possible the anesthesia was still in his system almost 2 weeks after the surgery and causing the VPCs? Has anyone else experienced this? Just looking for some insight...
 
Bojie

Bojie

New member
Did they do any other blood work besides a troponin? Make sure they do a Basic metabolic panel so that they check all the electrolytes. Many times if an electrolyte level is abnormal it can cause arrhythmia. I don't think that it's from the anesthesia. That should be out of his system by now, and it is likely he was having these PVC's prior to surgery, you just never had any reason to know about it.

Just make sure they do a complete panel on him. Troponin level isn't enough.
 
takemebacktotulsa

takemebacktotulsa

New member
Thanks for the suggestion, Meg. Willis had blood drawn in early December and everything was within range, so taking another sample to compare is a good idea.
 
Ivoryudx

Ivoryudx

New member
Has he ever been checked by a Cardiologist? At only two years of age, I would be getting him to a Cardiologist for a doppler.
 
CMDRTED

CMDRTED

New member
As far as the anesthesia is concerned. It stay in people up to 6 months according to my wife (the Scrub Tech), so it would not surprise me if it stays in dogs an extended period of time. I would definately do the Cardio thing.
 
ElvisTheNewf

ElvisTheNewf

Active member
An echo is a heart ultrasound. Getting a full blood panel would be the first step, like Meg said there are several electrolyte imbalances that can cause the heart to do funky things. The next step may be a holter monitor - he'd be hooked up to a wire pack for a certain amount of time (24-48 hours) that tracks his heart beat. You'd probably keep a diary of what he's doing (sleeping, exercise) and then they'd match up any weird heart activity with what he was doing at the time. I've had one and so have a lot of my patients, but when we were at OSU I saw a dog wearing one.

18 PVC's in a minute is a lot (at least for a kid), but Willis probably was a little nervous during the echo and that may have had an effect on his heart beat. I'm glad you're getting it checked out - sometimes these things just happen and don't really have a cause. This may have been happening all his life.
 
takemebacktotulsa

takemebacktotulsa

New member
Willis was last examined by a board certified cardiologist at 10 weeks. No vet has ever heard anything unusual with regard to his heart. And the blood he's had drawn has always been normal. We had an echocardiogram done at the internal specialist's office last week. While he's not a board certified cardiologist, he is board certified in internal medicine, and what is considered the best specialist in town. He did not mention the term doppler, but being from Oklahoma, I'm familiar with the term as all of our weathermen use this technology...a lot :) I'm assuming a cardio w/ doppler would be identified the same way: with colored areas on the echo. If so, doppler was not used as I went over the echo w/ the specialist and it was a normal b/w ultrasound. Velocity was normal on the echocardiogram, though. They found no explanation for the VPCs on the echo.

As far as I can tell, we have no board certified cardiologists in our state. We do have a good teaching hospital with a cardiology dept. at Okla State in Stillwater. And the specialist we are seeing is consulting w/ doctors at Ohio State. I'm definitely open to traveling to see a cardiologist if needed, but thought it might be good to rule out causes like ticks or other diseases that could cause this first. I have a call into the doc to see if he has troponin results yet and will ask about a full blood panel when we talk.

I really don't know what I'm doing here, so any advice is much appreciated. Thank you all.
 
KatieB

KatieB

New member
Our Berner Murphy has many VPCs. He also has atrial fibrillation. I would have your boy wear a holter monitor. It's a 24 to 48 hour EKG recording. They wear a vest and go about their daily activities. You write down what your dog is doing throughout the day so when they look at it they can tell when issues might be occurring. It was helpful with our Berner to get his anti arrhythmia medication at the right dosage. Otherwise it sounds like you are doing everything right. 18 VPCs a minute is a lot but given that dogs heart rates are faster than ours it doesn't seem like its in a range to be extremely concerned. I would look at his electrolytes and if anything looks low normal would treat it and Id recommend seeing a Cardio if you can and checking a holter monitor. Our boys VPCs and occasional runs of vtach have been well controlled with medication.
 
takemebacktotulsa

takemebacktotulsa

New member
Katie, thanks for letting me know about Murphy and giving me hope!
We've talked about a holter as one of our next steps depending upon blood test results.

Janice, thank you so much for the info. I can't get the acvim site to work but I see there is a clinic in our area in a couple of weeks. I'm making plans now to attend.

You guys are the best. Thank you.
 
Brandie&Maggie

Brandie&Maggie

New member
Hope Mr. Willis is ok! Keep us posted on his test results. Hopefully its nothing to worry about, just to watch. A clear echo is a great sign.

I don't have experience with this in dogs, but if everything else checks out, it may not be anything to worry about unless he has other symptoms. PVC's (Premature Ventricular Contractions) are a fairly common arrhythmia to have and sometimes the cause is unknown. He could have been having them his whole life and you'd have no reason to know. They can be increased by stress, etc. (i.e. the anesthesia could have compounded it).

Apparently in humans a large portion of the population has them and has no idea.

My husband gets them regularly. We know because he can feel them. Usually he gets them only once or twice a month. A few years ago, during a stressful time when he was working 2 jobs, he started getting about 30 a minute. We went to the emergency room. A full cardiac workup and stress test, and holter, showed no additional cause for concern. The PVC's went back to normal (1-2 a month) after a few days. After cutting out caffeine completely he now does have have them anymore that we know of.
 
Ivoryudx

Ivoryudx

New member
IMO, and from experience, save your time and money, and get to the nearest Cardiologist. I tried a Internist with A LOT of experience, to save money, and ended up with the wrong diagnosis which was easily caught by the Cardiologist. There just isn't a comparison, so if there is any chance at all, go to the Cardiologist.
 
takemebacktotulsa

takemebacktotulsa

New member
I spoke w/ the specialist last night and he checked the blood test taken right before the surgery--all normal levels, including electrolytes. He mentioned a cardiologist will be coming on staff at OSU in May (yay!). I called OSU today to inquire and they told me they have a visiting cardiologist with a couple of appointments available this week, so I've left a message with the specialist to see if we can get a referral and get in to see the cardiologist before they leave. Hopefully we'll get the troponin results and get in with the cardiologist this week as I'm anxious to get some answers.

I really appreciate everyone's experiences and advice.
 
takemebacktotulsa

takemebacktotulsa

New member
Anyone seen Dr. Gilbert Jacobs from GA before? My vet wants me to wait to see Dr. Baumwart when he comes on staff in May regardless of whether we see Jacobs now or not. He thinks Baumwart is super thorough. He said it's ok to wait, but I'm not the most patient person and want some answers. If anyone has experience with either, will you let me know?
 
KatieB

KatieB

New member
I don't really think the troponin is going to tell you anything so I wouldnt' worry about getting those results back before seeing a cardiologist. If they have a visiting cardio I would go to them and see if you can get a holter monitor set up. I really think that's your best bet to see what's going on. Haven't heard of either cardio guy but I don't think it's a bad idea to see the visiting guy since you can get in sooner. I'm not a patient person so would not like waiting until May.
 
Bojie

Bojie

New member
takemebacktotulsa said:
Anyone seen Dr. Gilbert Jacobs from GA before? My vet wants me to wait to see Dr. Baumwart when he comes on staff in May regardless of whether we see Jacobs now or not. He thinks Baumwart is super thorough. He said it's ok to wait, but I'm not the most patient person and want some answers. If anyone has experience with either, will you let me know?
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No experience with them. But I agree with Katie. I wouldn't wait. I'm sure you've read up on all of this stuff already but too many VPC's in a row just one time could be very bad. Get in to whoever you can as soon as you can, and then come May if you'd still like to see the other doc, then you can.
 
ElvisTheNewf

ElvisTheNewf

Active member
At the very least the first visiting guy could order the holter monitor and you could get that out of the way. Then either he or the new guy could review the results.
 
takemebacktotulsa

takemebacktotulsa

New member
Yeah, there's no way I would wait until May to see somebody. I made an appointment with the visiting cardiologist earlier today and asked them to be prepared with the holter. The specialist let me know the troponin results were normal. He did say he wants the other cardiologist to read the results.
 
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