what happened in oklahoma?????

[brookside]

I have been off this site for a bit due to my health condition but I heard from a friend that a dog she bred died at the oklahoma show because he and another newfie puppy spent the night in the van. I guess the daytime temperatures were 103 and then they spent the night in the van. after that..I'm sure it was still pretty darned hot.She is really upset with the Colorado owner as is the breeder of the puppy (who lived, I guess). What is happeningn to this world?
You know something terrible is going on in this world. So much sorry. So much sadness. PLEASE LOVE YOUR DOGS. PLEASE KEEP THEM SAFE. Say a little prayer for Dalton, the Newfie who died.

 

[ardeagold]

This happened in OK? Same thing just happened last week in MO except 7 dogs died.

What is WRONG with these handlers? Are they just stupid?

 

[brookside]

This was NOT a handler, this was an OWNER. Look at the onofrio site for show results and you can see Dalton marked as absent all the days. I wonder when it happened??? Like the first night, even before the show started? My friend, the breeder is just heart broken. She also knew one of the dogs in the van of the handler in Missouri. It was a golden who was supposed to be a friend of her's next special....look at onofrio site and you can see that this golden took at Group III one of the days. The girl who was supposed to start specialing this golden in WISC is the stud dog's owner. Such sadness is EVERYWHERE. Make this sadness stop.
Just an aside, I am so unhappy cuz my best friend just got diagnosed with pancreatic cancer; another friends brother just died today, I need a mastectomy and I found ALLLLLL this crap out today. I cannot take any more.

 

[ardeagold]

I do know who the Goldens were. I'm on a huge Golden site...and many there knew the dogs and the owners. There was also a Dalmation and an Akita, I believe.

I just don't understand how people can be so dense, honestly. Stupidity that injures or kills a human is a crime...I think it should be when it comes to pets, too. Reckless endangerment? Manslaughter? (any culpable homicide which is not murder or infanticide).

Unfortunately, our laws aren't that advanced, yet. I hope, one day, they will be, then maybe more people will start to value the lives of those entrusted to their (our) care, and not only human life. (Although there are plenty out there who don't value human life either).

I realize that "livestock" kept/raised for the purpose of food, couldn't fall under that type of law, but "pets" surely could. If people knew they could be charged and go to jail/prison for their recklessness...perhaps things would change for the better.

 

[SunnyD]

Donna, I agree with all that you said. It is a crime. IMO, entrusting your animal to someone else's care isn't any different than entrusting your child to a daycare provider. They are not expendable.

 

[janices]

Actually that's not the story on Oklahoma. There was an interview done with somebody other than the owner that is misleading.

This is from another list I'm on TxShowDogs:
Hello list,
Posted on behalf of Cydney Jones - owner of "Dalton"

I just got off the phone with the handler of "Dalton" the Newfoundland that died
at the OKC show. His owner (Cydney Jones) is there and would like to clear a
few points as the interview is misleading and upsetting. First she is
devastated over his loss. The young lady Samantha that was interviewed was a
passenger and not the owner of the dog. She is a junior and didn't know quite
how to handle the interview. Dalton's owner could not be interviewed - she was
too upset. Dalton had a history of cardiac issues and it is believed the stress
of the trip and perhaps the climate change from CO may have played a part in his
passing - that is still an unknown. The dogs were not left unattended as the
interview may lead us to believe. They were unloading with the AC cooling well.
They were concerned about symptoms Dalton began to exhibit and were trying to
get things in order to get him out of the air conditioned van into the building.
Dalton collapsed while being taken in. They feel it was his heart but are
trying to confirm that themselves at this time.

Although his owner - like the news crew and superintendents - encourages
everyone to be careful in this heat while traveling she wants to make sure that
the fancy knows they did not abandon "Dalton" in a hot vehicle and they took
every precaution to keep him safe. The other Newfoundland is fine.

Thank you - permission to cross post
Stephanie Cottrell, OshoZen Akitas & Newfoundlands

 

[brookside]

My friend who is the breeder told me that she too had heard that the owner said Dalton had a heart condition. She is so mad as she told me that he was cardiac cleared at 1 year by a cardiologist. Something is fishy there.

 

[brookside]

I do need to make a correction to my above statement. I looked on OFA website and his name is not there. Perhaps he was checked but not submitted. so who knows about that one.

 

[BluwaterNewfs]

My friend who is the breeder told me that she too had heard that the owner said Dalton had a heart condition. She is so mad as she told me that he was cardiac cleared at 1 year by a cardiologist. Something is fishy there.

A dog can have clear cardiac check at year and develop problems at a later age. I knew someone who had a dog that pass puppy check and adult check, each done by a different cardiologist. A year later is was discovered the dog did have a problem.

 

[brookside]

I know that too. I've actually known 2 dogs that were cleared 2 times until they had a doppler and then were not clear. Whatever it is, it is a sad story for the dog, the owner and breeder.

 

[BluwaterNewfs]

Yes it is sad! I was just responding to the statement that something is fishy because the dog cleared at 1 year.

 

[ardeagold]

There are other heart conditions that can't be heard at a year....especially by auscultation only. The only way to know for sure is to Doppler.

Anyway...I feel badly for Dalton, his owner and his breeder. Hopefully this isn't another heat related death, and it was a unique medical situation with that dog. Doesn't make it any less painful, but unfortunately sudden death can happen.

 

[janices]

I really don't consider heart clear unless a doppler's been done. I doppler to clear. I had a pyr that the murmur almost got missed by cardiologist, doppler found 3 heart problems, and cardiologist didn't think the faint murmur heard was from the SAS. It's hard to pick up trivial SAS from auscultation only.

I feel sorry for the owner. That's a very difficult way to lose a newf. It was mentioned to me that another newf left the show because of the heat.

Coming from Colorado altitudes into lower altitudes and vice versa is not easy for dogs or people since have to adjust to altitude changes and can get altitude sickness. Body has to acclimatize properly and with the heat can make it even more difficult.

 

[Sun Valley]

I really don't consider heart clear unless a doppler's been done. I doppler to clear.

Janice, I am curious to know if you dopplered your litter to make sure all hearts were clear or were they only auscultated?

I know many breeders in Europe routinely doppler puppies. But then I think they pay a fraction of what we have to pay here.

When I was on the Health and Longevity committee, I went to bat to have all breeding stock dopplered, but some/most people didn't feel dopplering was necessary.

Lou Ann

 

[janices]

Janice, I am curious to know if you dopplered your litter to make sure all hearts were clear or were they only auscultated?

I know many breeders in Europe routinely doppler puppies. But then I think they pay a fraction of what we have to pay here.

When I was on the Health and Longevity committee, I went to bat to have all breeding stock dopplered, but some/most people didn't feel dopplering was necessary.

Lou Ann

I think that may be true. Overseas pays a fraction of our costs. I had auscultation run for litter and if that had showed up anything we would have dopplered. My contract has a clause asking for clearances once old enough for OFA db and asking results be submitted to OFA and left open. Get some incentive $ back for doing clearances. The two I have here will be dopplered once old enough for OFA db. I think there are some problems that take time to appear so waiting to doppler may be more beneficial. I know there are people don't feel it's necessary to doppler breeding stock but I think trivial SAS can get missed and some of the trivial valve problems might get missed and signs of DCM don't appear until older.

 

[ardeagold]

Mira was Dopplered...and it showed two MINOR valve issues.

She has a "mild aortic valvular insufficiency and very mild mitral valvular insufficiency. Good cardiac function. No evidence of congestive heart failure AT THIS TIME. No cardiac therapy required at this time". This is from the report done by the Cardio Vet on 3/3/06.

Interestingly, he auscultated her first...and heard NOTHING. Since I was there with both Molly and Mira...I wanted him to doppler both. This is was he SAW...didn't hear a thing, and he kept listening, especially after he saw the two "issues".

I took her to a Cardio clinic a year later...they heard nothing. I've had her rechecked again...nothing heard. IF in her yearly checkups they hear anything at all...it means the murmurs are louder, and then we'd re-doppler again to see if there's valve deterioration which requires meds.

That proved to me that clear by auscultation doesn't necessarily mean "clear" of defects. Over time these minor defects can get worse....or, even better.

I have a mitral valve prolapse (or had one for YEARS) which seems to have disappeared entirely. It used to be so loud the Cardiologist said he could hear it without a stethoscope. It was visible on an echocardiogram, too. As of two years ago, it wasn't showing on an echo (doppler)...it was gone. They said that can happen. I never knew that.

Anyway...Cole is clear by auscultation...and I asked the Cardio Vet if he should be dopplered. His response was that Cole's heart was so big and strong and LOUD that he could hear everything clearly and felt there was no need. However, if he's ever bred...he'll get a doppler first. That's just me. I want to know for sure if anything is "off"...even if it's not a genetic condition.

Mira and Molly are both spayed...but I have every clearance suggested by the NCA plus some. I did patellas, thyroid and eyes too. I did it for my peace of mind...so I wouldn't have any surprises with their health in the future. Thyroid is rechecked every couple of years (even if they're healthy) and I use the first one as a baseline to see if there are changes. It's a good thing to have in case something goes haywire later.

 

[M & M's Mom Linda]

We had both boys dopplered at a year old...even though they will not be bred. We had it done for our own piece of mind. A couple of the shows in the area offer a heart clinic so the cost was much less...I think about $185. Our breeder will give us 10% back on any test we do that is reported to OFA.

What are the changes of heart problems later in life if the doppler was clear?

It certainly sounds like it was a medical condition rather than just heat with Dalton. I feel bad for all involved.

 

[Joan Fisher]

Such sadness is EVERYWHERE. Make this sadness stop.
Just an aside, I am so unhappy cuz my best friend just got diagnosed with pancreatic cancer; another friends brother just died today, I need a mastectomy and I found ALLLLLL this crap out today. I cannot take any more.

:hugs:Becky, I am so sorry to hear that you need a mastectomy on top of your sadness for your friends. A pretty overwhelming day for you - I will be thinking of you and praying that everything goes well for both you and your friend. Sorry for your friend whose brother died.

 

[cedarvalleynewfoundlands]

..........
What are the changes of heart problems later in life if the doppler was clear?

It all depends. A doppler would rule out anything congenital, but wouldnt rule out other problems that can occur as a dog ages. It would be similar to a Cardiac Cath in a human. Just because you have a clear cath doesnt mean you cant develop a heart problem down the road.
In human medicine, it isnt uncommon to have a clear cath, and then a few years down the road have a heart problem crop up.

 

[CMDRTED]

I know things do crop up. Ethel was checked by a cardio at one year, and was cleared. We had it done In Warwick, as we were doing everyone else. The Cardio there wanted to do a doppler as they thought they heard something funny. Tu8rns out Ethel has a small extra piece of flest on one valve that makes a funny noise when the heart beats, but otherwise presents no problem. I'm very glad I had it done. I even got to watch while he explained what we were looking at. Very cool Vet.