Update! Met 1st Newfie Breeder today!

Broseph080

New member
This is an update of my previous couple posts. I am the college student who is looking into getting a Newfie in the near future. About the breeder: She breeds 3 different types of dogs, Beagles, Inus, and Newfie's. She owns a huge lot with a decent amount of beagles and Inus, probably around 15 combined. Then she had around 50 Newfie's! 15 puppies, 6 adult dogs she bred, and 30 juvenile dogs. She's State certified (Missouri) and US certified. She's apart of the AKC and APBT. She allowed us to see every dog and all their living conditions, but the only catch was that we weren't allowed to go into the cages to interact with the dogs (I forgot her reasoning why). The Newfie's are only breed 2 times per year and they start breeding at the age of 2 and stop at 6 years of age. They let their puppies go when they reach the age of 8 weeks and they also offer a 1 year health guarantee. She said all the pups go through a full vet examination when they reach 3 weeks and another when they are sold. The small puppies were kept in a 15ft by 15ft pin with a large shaded spot (it was a very very nice setup). The bigger dogs had a space of around 25ft by 100ft, also a very well done setup with a large shaded spot.
All in all the dogs seemed to be very healthy and active. The only red flagged I noticed was that they breed multiple dogs. And all the parents records are flawless :) And the price of the dogs are 1775 for blacks, 1875 for browns, 1975 for land seer and 2100 for the grey Newfie's.
 

Codes

Active member
Keep looking!!! Newfie pups should not go home until they are between 9-10 weeks of age AFTER they have had a trip to a board certified cardiologist. Sorry but I see many red flags in your post. It does take time to find the right pup and the right breeder. It is definitely worth the wait when you find the right combination. Don't settle or act too quickly.
 

Jeannie

Super Moderator
Remember you live in a state with many puppy mills. HUGE RED FLAGS! Three breeds? She has 50 newfies? PUPPY MILL!!!!! CAGES? No breeder who loves the breed is going to keep their breeding dogs in a cage. The will live in the house with the breeder. No breeder should ask different prices for different colors. Also no newf puppy should be sold until they have their hearts checked for SAS. That cannot be done until 10 weeks of age. Did you ask her to see the health clearances of her breeding dogs? I bet she does not have any. Does she show her dogs? If not, how does she know she is breeding to meet the breed standards. Is she a member of the local breed club? Is she a member of the NCA? I'd run from this so called breeder as fast as I can.

I suggest you read the stickies in various forums
http://www.newf.net/Forums/showthread.php?t=85551 How to choose a breeder
http://www.newf.net/Forums/showthread.php?t=39038 How to check for health clearances
http://www.newf.net/Forums/showthread.php?t=106334 10 week cardiac test
 
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Broseph080

New member
She said all of her breeding dogs have health clearances. Glad i posted on here to get your thoughts and opinions!! And she is just apart of groups i posted above! Thanks guys
 

mrs big dogs

New member
I think I would RUN away from this breeder, like mentioned above too many red flags, please don't be in a hurry when you buy any breed of dog,she sounds like a BYB/puppy miller.
 

Broseph080

New member
Thanks for your information! I'm definitely not going back to that mill! Anyone ever heard of a farm in Arizona called strawberry mountain newfoundlands?
 

wrknnwf

Active member
Awesome job! You just ferreted out your first puppy mill and I am so proud that you asked good questions. The responses you've gotten here are spot on. Keep looking my friend.
 

wrknnwf

Active member
Thanks for your information! I'm definitely not going back to that mill! Anyone ever heard of a farm in Arizona called strawberry mountain newfoundlands?
I could not find any of their dogs in the OFA database. But that's only an indication that the breeder didn't list the clearances publicly, it doesn't necessarily mean that the dogs don't have them. In that case, you need the breeder to show you the test certification and you need to know what the OFA number means. And by "show you" I mean, you hold the original certification or pedigrees or any other paperwork with the certifying bodies original stamp or logo in your hand. Its too easy to Photoshop something and email it to gullible buyers. Be sure to verify anything you get at the testing body's website.

For example using one of my own dogs, here's an OFA designation for an elbow dysplasia test: (learn more here)

FCP/DJD II - means she didn't clear and had FCP (fragmented coronoid process) with degenerative, grade 2 joint disease.

Here's her hip cert:

NF-8949G27F-PI - Her hips did clear with a "Good" designation. See the G in that alpha numeric sequence? Here's what the whole sequence means...

NF = Breed Code, in this case a Newfoundland
8949 = Ascending numerical identifier given to each animal within a breed evaluated as normal and given a number, in this case the 8949th Newf to be given a number
G = The phenotypic (physical (in this case by means of xrays)) OFA evaluation, in this case "Good" hips. The designations are E = Excellent, G (Good), and F (Fair).
27 = The age in months when the testing was done, in this case 27 months. While you can have preliminary tests done on young dogs, around 24 months is the age at which the hip evaluation is considered certifiable. I had hers done at 7 month (prelim) and 27 months (final result).
F = Sex, in this case a female
PI or VPI = Indicates that the animal has been permanently identified in the form of tattoo or microchip. If the dog is permanently identified AND the id has been verified and signed off by the attending veterinarian, a suffix of VPI is applied. If the animals lacks permanent identification, a suffix of NOPI is applied. I had her microchipped as a pup, but didn't know to ask the vet to verify it or indicate it on the form when the final xrays were done.

Now just because my dog didn't pass one of her clearances doesn't mean too much until you start looking at her siblings and other relatives.

Here's the page to look up dogs that are in the open database. OFA Database Search It's kind of tricky to use, but just put in the first part of the dog's name and select Newfoundland in the box below, then press "search". Don't fill out the rest of the "form". If you use the kennel name that should bring up all the Newfs in that kennel that have had their tests posted in the public database. But you need the dog's full registered name to do that. Breeder's may own dogs or use breeding stock with other kennel names. Ask the breeder for that info. There should be no problem getting it.

If you only use the dog's name you may not get a result. You can't find anything with just a "call" name (his nickname). You have to fiddle around with it. Try just putting in the first 4 letters of either the kennel name or dog's name. Check the little radio button to the, right in that same section indicating "first part of name". If you don't get a result, try using other variations. If you search before you go see the breeder, you will be prepared to ask for proof of certification/registration if their dogs don't show up or you can't find them in the database.

If you click on any dog's name, it will bring up a page that lists that particular dog and any other related dogs that have been listed in the database. This can be useful in determining how prevalent a defect is in those lines. But no lines are perfect, so expect to see a relative of that dog that didn't pass something or wasn't perfect. It's mostly just informational. Not a predictor of anything or a guarantee that your pup will be free of defects. But it's worth looking at so you can increase your chances of a healthy dog.

The point of all this checking is that a good breeder or owner is willing to use an open database, even if some of the tests aren't passed. It's just as likely that the buyers post their dog's results. But a breeder is also an owner and should post results on their breeding stock. Above all, IMHO, it's an indication that a breeder is honest about any faults in their lines and is probably making an effort to improve the breed.

There are other clearances that a Newf should have and you may find those on other websites. But OFA is the best place to start (and there are links to other certifying bodies like CERF - eye tests or CHIC - list of dogs that have had ALL recommended tests). There is SO much other info there besides just the database and you will learn a LOT! So spend some time on their website and others reading as much as you can. www.offa.org

It's a lot to ask, but hey, education is important, as any college student knows.
 
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NinaA

New member
Glad you posted here. Hope you see that there are many red flags. The 8 week one jumped out at me before I even read it. I maintain one of the reasons Moonlight turned out so well for me is because her breeder insisted on keeping her until at least 12 weeks. I got her at 14 weeks and she never cried at night, was a breeze to house train, and was very respectful of the other dogs in the house. All results of a mommy training her puppy correctly. And, that's just from one of the red flags.
 
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