Question for raw feeders

[sarnewfie]

do any of you that breed feel safe feeding raw to pregnant girls?
i have the bravo in the tube, but am fearful that salminila, will invade the tummy and affect the "kids"
any help on this would be appreciated.
i normally give this to them in the second half of pregnancy due to picky eating. i have done this with one girl, so far, and still am fearful.

 

[Codes]

I know of several people who feed their pregnant bitches raw food and then wean the puppies on that diet as well. They have had wonderful success. Granted, you have to do whatever makes you comfortable

 

[BoundlessNewfs]

I belong to a raw feeding list, and many of the breeders in there feed only raw to their girls and then wean the pups to it, as well. They all swear by it.

 

[Newfs Forever]

SAR,

Their hydrochloric acid is much greater than ours. That takes care of alot of stuff.

Sue

 

[saddust]

Also... remember that salmonella is EVERYWHERE... on the ground - the grocery cart handle.... your neighbor's hands - YOUR hands.... in goose poop that you walk past every day - on your dog's tongue... on the other end as well (and we know how much they like to put their mouths there!

)... Salmonella is typically a problem when there is an overgrowth - more than the body can handle - and then it typically causes the runs....

The key is keeping a strong healthy immune system so it can handle every day encounters and amounts of salmonella (and other everyday nasty organisms)... without issues...

And anatomically - the canine digestive tract is much shorter (basically the absence of the lower intestines (which is needed to absorb and digest things like grains and veggies that take longer for their cellular walls to break down)) ... not affording the opportunity for the bacterial overgrowth to occur...

Not saying you should or shouldn't feed it - just a couple reasons to help you weigh the pros and cons ....

karen

 

[Laura_Loomis]

No offense SAR, but I am always amused when people worry about their dogs and bacteria. Assumming the dog is otherwise healthy, of course. After all, we are talking about an animal that uses its tounge for toilet paper...

 

[sarnewfie]

no offense taken!
but,,,, i have a lot invested! dont want to run into problems, so far so good, she gets a meal at about five ish , of the bravo raw, beef.
i may have to order more, she is gobbling it down, codes and the others helped set my mind to ease.
penny did good, so now hopefully tasha will to!
thanx guys

 

[Laura_Loomis]

Bravo is a good quality product. Unless you have a dog with a seriously compromised immune system, you should be fine. I know lots and lots of people who feed raw while breeding (well, all the time). There is a list called raw-breeder or something on yahoo that talk about feeding raw to preg and puppies.

My vet said that if you have one with absolutely NO immune system, it can be better to feed large pieces unstead of ground, and then wash and sear the outsides to kill in bacteria, but pregnant doesn't equal imuno-compromised...

 

[sarnewfie]

ok thanx laura
two of my pups went thru major growth spurts, one is odd looking a little bit in one pastern angles out a bit to the side, the other is minor same angle but both gait straight, the male a tad out at the foot but barely, i was told to do chicken backs or necks one meal the synorgen the next, one was on the canidae, until this week, the ohter is on fromms.
so i am thinking this will help them a lot, at least i hope it does.
i was told this by a bravo feeder, can you guys tell me, in bravo what is equivelant to the turkey necks ground or chicken backs ground
a couple people are not comfy with the bone aspect, i cant blame them! LOL
from what i am told by this bravo feeder is this:
A growth spurt can certainly make things look worse than they are. This is one of the reasons I feed raw, puppies take in exactly how much calcium/phosphorus is needed and the rest is excreted. He probably needs more at this time. Can the owner give him some turkey necks or chicken backs so he gets natural calcium. The problem with calcium in dog food is if it is too much it cannot be excreted and too much calcium has the same impact as not enough calcium.
######################
what are your thoughts ?

[ 06-06-2005, 05:21 PM: Message edited by: sarnewfie ]

 

[BoundlessNewfs]

Christine, when I switched the girls over from a giant breed kibble to raw, Lucy's growth seemed to noticeably slow down. She had been growing at a rate comparable to Maggie's (which was way too fast, if you ask me). For the past year, she's been growing nice and steady, and still looks like a leggy pup, instead of a year and a half old. She's got a nice broad chest, and is starting to have a broader rib-cage and a little meat on her bones, but that girl is an athlete...lots of muscle and not much fat. I can tell that her head shape has changed in the past few months, too. She looks less like a large English Setter, and more like a newf (finally!) She's just a beautiful girl (OK...I'm a little bit partial).

We feed the holistic/raw diet by Wendy Volhard: "Holistic Guide for a Healthy Dog". They get calcium from the bones and the cartilage is like a natural glucosamine. They also get calcium in a form they can use, from the egg shells. We feed raw eggs every other day (shell and all!)...just crack the egg and mix it into their breakfast...and crunch the shell up in our fingers then add it, too. Been feeding this way for over a year, and the girls look gorgeous.

Granted, she could use a bath and a trim in this pic...but she's still gorgeous to me.

[ 06-06-2005, 09:32 PM: Message edited by: New2Newfs ]

 

[Laura_Loomis]

If your question is "raw feeding allows dogs to absorb natural calsium and excreet the extra" then yes. Raw fed dogs tend to grow slowly, not because they are lacking nutrition, but because their bodies get it in the natural ratio (this is particularly true of the frankenprey model, as my friends call it, where whole animals are fed...)

I am planning to donate my library on raw/holistic dog care to the auction at the gathering (assumming it hasn't been packed yet). If you are interested in the theory of raw feeding, maybe you will want to bid....

 

[Angela]

Gracie was fed raw diet from the time she came to us at 7 1/2 weeks (don't even discuss that!!!!) She was immediately weaned off kibble and started on the Billingshurst raw diet. She grew very slowly, never had one problem, always growing evenly. Today, at 5 1/2 yrs she is small for a Newf at 95 lb and 24". Some people believe that feeding raw from that age makes for a smaller dog, I don't know if this is really true or if she would have been small anyway.
She is the only Newf I have fed this way from that age, and the only Newf not to have had at least one of - down on pasterns, limping, pano, growth spurts.

 

[sarnewfie]

out of each litter, raised on synorgen, one pup will have the growth spurts that are to fast, if we can pin down that pup, we can put him on raw, i hope this does the trick!

i dont think there is a diet that works for all
i think there are many diets that will work for several.
i have seen some raw fed that grew slow but had red coats, and i mean red coats till they hit two years, whatz up with that?

P.s.
to clarify
it is normally a male, not a female that does this one of each litter, the pastern angles out, to the side a small amount, it is during teething this occurs, i am of the opinion during teething all the calcium is drawn to the mouth, where it is needed, wich is why they seem to have loss of bone during that time, and also with gaining height, the bone is growing long, wich prevents it from adding thickness to it, with the bone coming back thru ought the rest of the growing, wich is up to tthree years, sydney just put on more bone his third year.
This is Why it is SO Important puppy people stay in CLOSE contact with their breeders.
i have had good luck so far, there usually seems to be one or two people that prefer to stay to themselves, i respect that but i dont get info that is important thru the growth.
the first year , communication is a plus to us, so we can help give advice thru people who are oldies, experienced, and have much knowlege.
ok thanx you guys.
i still am of the belief there is no miracle diet out there, i have seen some do poorly on raw, but.... who knows the circumstances, i do know, now that i know the bravo lady is near me, i will take advantage of it with this girl pup i keep, if i see the slightest sign of weakness to her pasterns i will be doing raw one meal the kibble the next.


[ 06-07-2005, 08:51 AM: Message edited by: sarnewfie ]

 

[darktarnsparhawk]

Hi Angela,

Ok I havent been around in awhile but I had to chime in here. My breeder has raised 6 litters on raw, some pups are weaned on to kibble as she is a realist and knows that not every one will or can do raw correctly.

As for samller dogs on raw, my latest pup is now 6 months old, 29 inches tall about 120 lbs. He is skin and bone!! He is a tall lad but he hasn't had any growth spurts and is infact developing slower than his brothers. Garion was feed on Royal Cainine till he was 2 and he had growth spurts and his legs went a bit out of shape. Changing his to the adult food helped. Oisin hasnt showen any this .Oisin is thrid generation raw, and when I brought him home I did have a bag of kibble, royal canine baby dog, but HE decided he didnt want it. In fact he would spit the kibble out in favour of fish or heart!!

 

[BoundlessNewfs]

Hi Roisin! Glad you came back.

 

[darktarnsparhawk]

Thanks Laurel,

I will try to stop by more regularly