....Has anyone noticed.........

[Windancer]

........More political judging than usual at the dog shows lately? I know it is always a factor , just like any other kind of animal showing...but it seems to have increased lately...just wondered if anyone else had noticed. In this time of money being tight for most of us, one is more reluctant to shell out entries and handling fees and not get a fair shake.

 

[luvxl k 9]

That is one of the main reasons why I've mainly been showing in the UKC and why UKC shows have been getting bigger and bigger, while AKC shows have gotten smaller, even with all their new classes, awards and such.

 

[DreamTime Newfs]

I have not noticed an increase in politics but I have noticed an increase poor quality dogs that are being shown and finishing.

 

[KatieB]

I haven't noticed an increase in politics at all. Experienced it only once while showing Mojo and I'm a completely novice owner handler. Every other time in the ring felt like I got a fair shake and the judge picked the best dog. I agree with Renee that there are a lot of poor quality dogs either in type or structure out there finishing with handlers on them. I think politics are more at play in the specials ring, but in the classes I didn't see a lot of politics issues.

 

[Sun Valley]

I have to chime in on this one and it is my opinion...as Renee said, we are seeing alot of poor quailty Newfs being shown and I am also seeing some of the mills and BYB hiring big time handlers to finish less then quality dogs...maybe to give themselves credibility, instead of working with a mentor and trying to breed good dogs per the standard.

Lou Ann

 

[Leonard and his bud Snuffles]

I know what Karen has told me of her experiences. And I know a few others who have relayed their past experiences. I also know my Pesky Little Varmint showing friend and their friends say if a certain well known handler is showing a Basset, you might as well plan on not winning. Glad I have NOTHING to do with all this crap.

 

[ardeagold]

I haven't noticed an increase in politics at all. Experienced it only once while showing Mojo and I'm a completely novice owner handler. Every other time in the ring felt like I got a fair shake and the judge picked the best dog. I agree with Renee that there are a lot of poor quality dogs either in type or structure out there finishing with handlers on them. I think politics are more at play in the specials ring, but in the classes I didn't see a lot of politics issues.

I have to chime in on this one and it is my opinion...as Renee said, we are seeing alot of poor quailty Newfs being shown and I am also seeing some of the mills and BYB hiring big time handlers to finish less then quality dogs...maybe to give themselves credibility, instead of working with a mentor and trying to breed good dogs per the standard.

Lou Ann

So, wouldn't what I put in bold be considered politics? Please correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying, in essence, is that the handler is winning...not the dog. And that's because of...politics!

 

[Newfobsessed]

I have to chime in on this one and it is my opinion...as Renee said, we are seeing alot of poor quailty Newfs being shown and I am also seeing some of the mills and BYB hiring big time handlers to finish less then quality dogs...maybe to give themselves credibility, instead of working with a mentor and trying to breed good dogs per the standard.

Lou Ann

I couldn't agree more with Renee and Lou Ann. Being new to the show world, I've seen the quality go down in the short time I have been witnessing it, and it breaks my heart. I have heard several mention that if a certain handler is in front of a certain judge, no matter who he is handling, he will get something worthwhile for his efforts. I've seen this happen years before with other breeds, but not with Newfoundlands. So I guess it is on the rise??

 

[Sun Valley]

So, wouldn't what I put in bold be considered politics? Please correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying, in essence, is that the handler is winning...not the dog. And that's because of...politics!

Yep...pure politics...

LA

 

[Sun Valley]

I think I may have said this awhile ago and will repeat it again, I would personally love to the see the AKC do away with professional handlers and make it a fair playing field for everyone.

LA

 

[ardeagold]

I think I may have said this awhile ago and will repeat it again, I would personally love to the see the AKC do away with professional handlers and make it a fair playing field for everyone.

LA

That's why people like the UKC so much. No pro handlers allowed.

I got Cole's UKC CH before I put him into the AKC, with me handling, LOL. Took two days (one weekend). It's a great atmosphere, nice people, relaxed, and a good way to take a dog into the competitive show venue and get them used to it without any stress running down that lead.

There's one coming up near Baltimore in May, which I might attend with Frankie.

Unfortunately I could never get their GRCH thru the UKC because there aren't enough Newfs in the shows within several hundred miles for him to compete against, or I'd do that too. It's fun!

OH...and a LOT of the AKC judges are UKC judges too. That's what they do, and it's their source of income, so the more judging assignments they have, no matter whether it's AKC or UKC, the better for their pocketbook.

 

[blstarke]

I think I may have said this awhile ago and will repeat it again, I would personally love to the see the AKC do away with professional handlers and make it a fair playing field for everyone.

LA

I couldn't agree with you more.

 

[KatieB]

Right Donna but it's not something I experienced except at one show. So I don't think it's increasing just staying the same. I just think the number of handlers showing nice dogs as opposed to poor dogs has changed.

 

[Sun Valley]

I just think the number of handlers showing nice dogs as opposed to poor dogs has changed.

Bingo! But again, I think that is because the dogs are changing and unfortunately not for the better.

LA

 

[KatieB]

I agree Lou Ann. I had multiple handlers tell me I did not need them to finish my dog that he was nice enough to easily finish on my own. So that may be why you see increasingly poor dogs with big handlers. Seemed to be the people hiring were people who needed them. Obviously not always the case but more often than not it seems to be.

 

[Newfobsessed]

Bingo! But again, I think that is because the dogs are changing and unfortunately not for the better.

LA

Absolutely!!! They are changing and the extremes are getting more extreme. The last show I saw had Newfs who more resembled flat coated retrievers, to huge Newfs with exaggerated heads. The consistency and goal to reach the AKC standard seems to have almost disappeared.

 

[janices]

Absolutely!!! They are changing and the extremes are getting more extreme. The last show I saw had Newfs who more resembled flat coated retrievers, to huge Newfs with exaggerated heads. The consistency and goal to reach the AKC standard seems to have almost disappeared.

Yes, I'm seeing set of extremes showing up at shows at both ends.

Anytime personal subjectivity plays role in an event you will see political influence. I'm doing more advising than ever before to my owners which shows to just stay away from and which to take a chance to enter and it's going to handlers know there going in under those judges. I used to track just judges now it's going into handlers too.

I don't have anything against handlers either.

 

[DreamTime Newfs]

Handlers are no handlers, I just think breed quality is suffering at this point. I do not have anything against people hiring handlers. I hate showing myself and my nervousness upsets the balance of the dog so I hire handlers or have friends handle them. Every year I see breed quality suffering more and more. It is very sad.

 

[KatieB]

I have nothing against handlers. THe issue here was politics and I think that some people hire handlers because they know and the handler knows the dog can't finish without the political clout becuase it's lacking type/structure/movement etc. I have no issue with handlers showing nice dogs who could win no matter who was on them....I do have issues with handlers showing dogs of poor quality and using their political clout to finish those dogs.

 

[ardeagold]

I don't have a problem with handlers either, since I'm really not all that good at it and have one. But, I think if everyone handled their own (or had a friend/family member do it), we'd mostly all be in the same boat...or at least there would be newbies entering the ring all the time, making everyone more comfortable. LOL

I agree with you Katie...I've seen a broad range as well. And a lot of switching off to a handler mid way through a cluster if the owner/handler isn't doing all that great.